Zeppelin L 70 and a DH 4

[R Coasby]

I am interested in the fate of Zeppelin L 70 on 5 August 1918. It was involved with other Zeppelins at what turned out to be the last raid by Airships on Britain in WW1

It was destroyed by two DH 4's piloted by Major Edgar Cadbury and Lieutenant R E Keys. They were based at the RNAS/RAF airfield at Denes near Great Yarmouth.

L 70 was apparently flying at between 16000 and 17000 feet.

Now the DH 4 was a well known and successful day bomber, but I am curious to know why it was employed as a point defence fighter on this occasion.

Questions?

Does anyone know the unit involved? Was it RNAS, RAF, or a special unit dedicated to attacking German Airships.

Why was the DH 4 used? Was it because it had a good ceiling, or was it because no other aircraft was available?

Are there any other examples of the DH 4 being used as a fighter?

One report stated that one of the DH 4's was carrying 2x100 lb bombs as well as two forward firing guns. This seems unlikely but can anyone confirm if this were true?

Roger Coasby

[EDWARD1]

An extract from Vol X111 The Great War The Standard History of The All European Conflict."......but on August 5th a squadron of four of the latest and most powerful Zeppelins, commanded by Captain Strasser, the chief of the German airship staff was sighted on the East Coast before it was dark. British aeroplanes at once attacked. The Germans rose to 19,000 feet, and retreated with all possible speed,but about 40 miles from the coast, L70, then the newest and most powerful German airship/ was overtaken by four machines of the DH9 type........"

I believe the DH9 was an upgraded DH4 with amongst other variations, forward facing pilot operated guns.

Eddie

[MikeMeech]

Hi

The L.70 incident is well covered in 'The Air Defence of Britain 1914-1918', Cole and Cheesman, Putnam, 1984, pages 436-445. And 'The Story of a North Sea Air Station', Snowden Gamble, Neville Spearman Ltd, 1967, pages 407-414. Both of these mention the bombs fitted and Cadbury releasing them after taking off, although he reported that it did not improve his climb rate. The ex-RNAS units of the RAF were from No. 4 Group. The Rolls-Royce Eagle powered DH.4s of Cadbury and Keys were the best performing aircraft for speed and altitude, especially when compared with the DH.9, this had a lower powered and less reliable engine, both types had a forward firing Vickers gun and lewis in the rear observer's position. The DH.9 was 'improved' in that the pilot and observer were close together so 'communication' was easier than the DH.4 where they were separated by the fuel tank. They did have a Gosport tube but this was unsuitable to use in combat situations. There had been experiments at Orfordness for improving communications between the observer and pilot in combat using simple Morse signals via a Klaxon near the pilot!

The air was quite busy that night with a variety of aircraft types from No. 4 Group and also from No. 6 Brigade, RAF, with aircraft types from Nos. 33, 38, 51, 75 and 76 Sqns (according to Cole and Cheesman).

Mike

[Adrian Roberts]

Its worth noting that it was Edgar Cadbury's observer Robert Leckie who fired the fatal shots. He could fire upwards; at 17000 feet it was difficult for the pilot to get the machine to fly upwards at enough of an angle to bring his gun to bear.

Uniquely, both these men had been involved in the downing of other Zeppelins: Cadbury of L21 and Leckie of L22. After the war, Cadbury went back to his chocolate factory; Leckie became an Air Marshal of the Royal Canadian Air Force.

[R Coasby]

Looking at John Rawling's excellent book 'Fighter Squadrons of the RAF' none of the units 33, 38, 51, 75 and 76 mentioned above by Mike operated the DH 4 in 1918.

My theory is that a special unit may have been set up on the East Coast specifically to target Zeppelins; both Cadbury and Leckie were experienced in combating Zeppelins.

If this is true where does such a unit fit into the organisation structure of the newly formed RAF? I cannot find any RNAS/RFC/RAF Squadron reference to a fighter unit equiped with DH 4's.based in that area.

I am still puzzled why a day bomber the DH 4 was the aircraft used, why not a Camel, SE 5 or Bristol Fighter?l.

I doubt it was DH 9 that intercepted L70 as they had unreliable Puma engines and poor high altitude performance

Roger

[MikeMeech]

Looking at John Rawling's excellent book 'Fighter Squadrons of the RAF' none of the units 33, 38, 51, 75 and 76 mentioned above by Mike operated the DH 4 in 1918.

My theory is that a special unit may have been set up on the East Coast specifically to target Zeppelins; both Cadbury and Leckie were experienced in combating Zeppelins.

If this is true where does such a unit fit into the organisation structure of the newly formed RAF? I cannot find any RNAS/RFC/RAF Squadron reference to a fighter unit equiped with DH 4's.based in that area.

I am still puzzled why a day bomber the DH 4 was the aircraft used, why not a Camel, SE 5 or Bristol Fighter?l.

I doubt it was DH 9 that intercepted L70 as they had unreliable Puma engines and poor high altitude performance

Roger

Hi Roger

As I mentioned Cadbury was from Yarmouth, which was part of 4 Group, RAF. In Cole & Cheesman, page 439, their 'rush' takeoff is explained:

"For unexplained reasons Yarmouth and other nearby No. 4 Group stations were not alerted until 20.50 hr. by which time L56 and L63, flying some 30 miles south of the other three airships, were less than ten miles from the aerodrome. There was a wild scramble for aircraft from the astonished aircrews who could see the two Zeppelins in the clear evening sky, east of the rapidly gathering cloud.

The Yarmouth pilots rightly considered that the station's best aircraft for Zeppelin hunting were the two D.H.4s powered by 375 hp Rolls-Royce Eagle VIII engines, and Keys grabbed the first of these. Egbert cadbury, who had been largely responsible for the destruction of L21 in November 1916, hastily deserted the audience at a nearby charity concert where his wife was singing and took off ten minutes later in the second. Acting as his gunner was Robert Leckie, co-pilot of the H-12 which had shot down L22 over the North Sea in May 1917. Another D.H.4, five D.H.9s, five Camels and an F.2A flying -boat were also airborne from Yarmouth, Burgh Castle and Covehithe."

The text continues in great detail on this nights action, with actions or non-action by the other types of aircraft detailed. As I said the incident is well covered no 'theories' are neccessary.

So a mixture of aeroplane types, not a 'special' D.H.4 unit.

The other units had a mixture of aircraft types in the air that night; 33 Sqn. - Bristol Fighters and FE.2bs and FE.2ds. 38 Sqn. - FE.2b. 51 sqn. - FE.2bs and FE.2ds. 75 Sqn. - Avro 504K. 76 Sqn. - BE. 12bs.

There was an organized air defence system which was equipped with a wide range of aircraft types that was spread over mainly eastern England, the main defence area was the 'London Air Defence Area', this included AA guns, barrage balloons, searchlights, various landing grounds as well as airdromes and reporting system as well as aircraft.

I hope that is of use.

Mike

[topgun1918]

Just to be absolutely clear, Lt R E Keys + AM A T Harman were in DH4 A8039, Maj E Cadbury + Capt R Leckie were in DH4 A8032.

Graeme

[R Coasby]

Thanks very much for the detailed account, it all makes much more sense to me now.

One last question; normally RAF Groups comprise several squadrons; do you know which if any Squadron, Cadbury and Leckie were attached to as part of 4 Group?

I would guess that Major Cadbury would have equivalent rank to Squadron leader.

Roger

[MikeMeech]

Thanks very much for the detailed account, it all makes much more sense to me now.

One last question; normally RAF Groups comprise several squadrons; do you know which if any Squadron, Cadbury and Leckie were attached to as part of 4 Group?

I would guess that Major Cadbury would have equivalent rank to Squadron leader.

Roger

Hi

The units at Great Yarmouth (RNAS Flights 490, 557 & 558) became 212 Sqn. RAF on 20th Aug. 1918. This unit had not been 12 (N) Sqn. as this had been a RNAS training unit elsewhere that had been disbanded on 1 April 1918. (details from Jefford's 'RAF Squadrons', 2nd Edition, Airlife, 2001).

This was part of No. 4 Group - Marine Operational, RAF. This was formed on 1.4.18. at Felixstowe, and disbanded 24.3.19. (details from Delve's 'The Source Book of the RAF', Airlife, 1994).

Mike