Staff Officers

[Stephen S]

While on my Information Quest for the Desert Mounted Corps I have come across these Staff officer titles and would like some help please.

What do they stand for ? ( titles not Staff )

What would the duties be of that position ?

and was there any other Staff Titles or positions not covered with these ? ( From the ANZAC Mounted Division for example )

1. GSO1

2. AA & QMG

3. CRHA

Did Brigade Staff have the same or similar Titles as Division Staff or Corps Staff ?

regards

Stephen

[Greenwoodman]

GSO = General Staff Officer grade 1 usually a Lt-Col

AA&QMG = Assistant Adjutant and Quarter Master General

CRHA = Commander Royal Horse Artillery

Perry's Order of Battle of Divisions mentions only these three positions for the Anzac Mounted Div.

Not fully au fait with their functions, but I'm sure someone else will fill it in.

[armourersergeant]

GSO1 operations, planning, senior staff officer.

AA&QMG...supply and logistics I think

CRHA..commander of the artillery brigades, usually CRA. Responsible for the co-ordination of all the artilleery units in the division.

I think this is correct.

Arm

[Ron Clifton]

Hello Stephen

The staff of a formation can be divided into four main types:

1. "The Staff" proper, which dealt with operational and policy matters, and was further divided into:

a. The General Staff, consisting of General Staff Officers 1st, 2nd and 3rd Grade, respectively GSO1 (lt-Cols), GSO2 (Majors) and GSO3 (Captains). This dealt with operations, intelligence and training matters, and also co-ordinated the work of the other branches.

b. The Adjutant-General's or 'A' Staff, consisting of Assistant Adjutants-General (AAG, Lt-Col), Deputy Assistant Adjutants-General (DAAG, Majors) and Staff Captains. This dealt with personnel matters: appointments and promotions, discipline, unit organisation, medals and awards, pay, medical and chaplaincy matters.

c. The Quartermaster-General's or 'Q' Staff, consisting of Assistant Quartermasters-General (AQMG, Lt-Col), Deputy Assistant Quartermasters-General (DAQMG, Majors) and Staff Captains. This dealt with suuply, equipment, transport and veterinary matters.

In smaller formations some of the functions of the A and Q Branches were combined, so you find an AA&QMG, Assistant Adjutant and Quartermaster-General, as the senior administrative staff officer with a division.

2. Administrative Services and Departments.

These were under Assistant Directors (Lt-Cols) and Deputy Assistant Directors (Majors). They covered medical, veterinary, supply & transport, ordnance and postal services, among others. They gave technical advice to either the A or Q Staff, and generally organised specialist work within the formation and its sub units.

3. Special Appointments.

These included the commander's aides-de-camp, a camp commandant for the higher formations (who was responsible for the internal economy and management of the physical HQ of the formation) and an Assistant Provost-Marshal (APM, usually a Captain) who looked after the Military Police and enforced discipline and traffic control.

4. Attached officers.

These were technical specialists RA and RE, usually with a small staff.

In August 1914 the staff of an infantry division consisted of the following:

General Officer Commanding (GOC, a Major-General) with two ADCs (Captains or subalterns);

one GSO1, one GSO2, one GSO3, one AA&QMG, one DAA&QMG, one DAQMG, one APM, one Assistant Director of Medial Services (ADMS), one DADMS, one AD Veterinary Services, one DAD Ordnance Services, and one Field Cashier (a captain or lieutenant of the Army Pay Dept).

Attached were the HQ Divisional Artillery: Brig-Gen RA (usually called CRA, Commander Royal Artillery), Brigade Major RA, Staff Captain RA, ADC, and the HQ Divisional Engineers: CRE (Commander RE, a Lt-Col) and an Adjutant RE (captain).

The staff of an infantry brigade was:

Commander (Brig-Gen), Brigade Major, Staff Captain (also acting as ADC) and a Veterinary Officer.

The Brigade Major carried out the General Staff side of the work, and the Staff Captain the A & Q side.

There were slight differences in cavalry divisions and brigades: for instance, there was, after October 1914, only one horse artillery brigade with each Cav Div, and its commander (Lt-Col) doubled as CRHA, and the OC Field Squadron RE (a major) doubled as CRE.

Corps HQs were of similar size: I can give you details if you need them. The senior General Staff officer was a BGGS, and the senior admin officer was a Deputy A&QMG, a full Colonel.

There were some minor changes during the course of the war, such as the addition of officers to superintend machine guns or trench mortars, and not all officers were of the ranks specified (e.g. by the Armistice, virtually all infantry Brigade Majors were only Captains).

Ron

[Stephen S]

Thanks to the fellas from the 'old sweats" mob for your replies.

It sounds as though the Australian organisation was based on the structure already in place in the British Army.

How did one train for one of these jobs ?

I wonder how much competition there was for officers to get a staff position ?

thanks again gentlemen.

Stephen

[Stephen S]

G'day Ron,

What a tremendous bit of information you have shared. It looks as though some fellas could be career staff officers if they stayed around long enough.

What uniform distinctions would staff officers have worn ( if any ) do you know ?

I am aware that Brigadiers or possibly Colonels and above ranks wore red collar and hat markings. Is this correct ?

Thanks again Ron.

regards

Stephen

[n cherry]

Staff Offciers had a systme of different amrbands they wore to distinguish who they were....this went all the way up to Army Commander and there is a photo of Plumer often used in books on Messines/Plumer of him wearing his special arm band.

Perhpas I ought to use the technical term which I think was brassard......

Also in the Great War you were allowed to wear a red band and gorgets if you were 'on the staff'.....officers only of ocurse.

This pracrice was dropped after the Great War and after that only Colonels and above had the red band....hope this helps.....

[ddycher]

Ron

Can you give a little bit more insight into the role of a camp commandant pls. Cant find a decent definition of the role and your comments above gave me a completely different spin after searching on the forum.

Regards

Dave

[Ron Clifton]

Hello Dave

Most Corps and Army HQs were established in villages or towns. The job of a camp commandant was to supervise the security, equipping and general "housekeeping" of the various buildings occupied by the staff - a kind of "maintenance supervisor cum catering manager cum building manager" in modern terms. He would also be the commanding officer, for disciplinary purposes, of all the Other Ranks in the HQ.

In divisional and brigade HQs similar duties were usually carried out by a Staff Captain or an ADC.

The idea was to relieve generals and staff officers of many of the routine admin responsibilities.

Ron

[ddycher]

Ron

Thanks for this. Was this typically a Western Front appointment or would this have been equally as appropriate in other theatres ? The officer I am looking at did not keep this appointment very long - only 3 months. Do you know if it was typical to be rotated so quickly.

Regards

Dave

[Pete1052]

Similar to Great War camp commandants are the current U.S. Army organizations called U.S. Army Garrison, or USAG, at its permanent installations within the U.S. USAGs are responsible for taking care of buildings and grounds, trash removal, plowing snow off the streets, and other housekeeping types of jobs. The idea is to prevent these kinds of day-to-day tasks from being distractions for the organizations and personnel that are stationed at the installations.

The following is how the Digger History website describes the staff organization of the 3rd Infantry Division, A.I.F., during the Great War.

*****

The division staff was divided into two parts, a General Staff Branch and an Adjutant and Quartermaster General's Branch. Each member of the headquarters staff had a role but titles were cumbersome and archaic, and for this reason are explained here.

GOC. General Officer Commanding.

This was the division commander, who was graded as a major general. He was responsible for all aspects of the division's performance. The staff's job was to reduce this to the point where it could be done by one man, by carrying out all the routine and administrative functions on his behalf.

ADC. Aide de Camp.

Graded a captain. The GOC had two aides, who acted as assistants, performing such duties as the GOC designated.

GSO1. General Staff Officer (1st Class).

The chief of staff, graded a lieutenant colonel or colonel. He was in charge of the General Staff Branch, responsible for training, intelligence, planning operations and directing the battle as it progressed. Most orders from the GOC were actually written up and signed by the GSO1.

GSO2. General Staff Officer (2nd Class).

The deputy chief of staff, graded a major. He assisted the GSO1.

GSO3. General Staff Officer (3rd Class).

Graded a captain. Usually responsible for intelligence.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

AA & QMG. Assistant Adjutant and Quartermaster General.

Graded a lieutenant colonel or colonel. He was in charge of the Adjutant and Quartermaster General's Branch, responsible for supply, transport, accommodation and personnel management.

DAA & QMG. Deputy Assistant Adjutant and Quartermaster General.

Graded a lieutenant colonel or colonel. He assisted the AA & QMG.

DAQMG. Deputy Assistant Quartermaster General.

Graded a major. He was responsible for supply, transport and accommodation.

DAAG. Deputy Assistant Adjutant General.

Graded a major. He was responsible for personnel administration, which included pay, establishments and promotions.

DADOS. Deputy Assistant Director of Ordnance Services.

Graded a major. Responsible for weapons, equipment and maintenance.

ADMS. Assistant Director Medical Services.

Graded a lieutenant colonel. The chief medical officer of the division. Controlled the three field ambulances and such other medical troops as might be attached to the division. Pre war doctrine had him subordinate to the AA & QMG but the debacle at Gallipoli demonstrated that he needed to have direct access to the GOC.

CRA. Commander, Royal Artillery.

Graded a colonel in 1914, he became a brigadier general in July 1915, and the title changed to BGRA. Controlled the division artillery and such other artillery as might be attached to the division.

BMRA. Brigade Major Royal Artillery.

Graded a major, was a staff officer assigned to the CRA.

CRE. Commander, Royal Engineers

Graded a lieutenant colonel. Controlled the division's three field companies and such other engineers or work details as might be attached to the division.

APM. Assistant Provost Marshal.

Graded a captain. Controlled the division's provost (military police).

In addition to the staff officers, division headquarters, of course, included many clerks who handled the actual paperwork on their behalf.

This information by Ross Mallett .

[Ron Clifton]

Dave

You can find Camp Commandants in all theatres.

As regards length of appointment, I have no details, but I cannot imagine it being a much-sought-after appointment. It might be a post saved for a disabled officer or one who was a bit of a "duffer". The demand for officers at the front, or in "proper" staff jobs, was such that anyone who was any good, and fit, would not spend much time running a camp behind the lines.

This is not quite the same as being the Commandant of a large training camp in the UK. Such an officer would be in general charge of all activities at the camp, including training, and this would call for a much stronger personality.

As I say, this is not based on any detailed knowlege, it is just my surmise.

Ron

[ddycher]

Thanks Ron

Fits as this particular officer seems to have taken the role on returning to active service after a period of being invalided out sick.

Regards

Dave