Shorts on the Somme

[haworthnick]

HAving just watched the "Battle of the Somme" at the IWM North, there was somew footage of troops going to the front (Warwickshires I think) and they are wearing shorts, was this common practice, as it was in the summer and would they have gone over the top in shorts?

Also was the idea of having the tin triangles on the backs of the packs discarded after the first day or was it continued throughout the rest of the conflict

Thanks

NIck

[jay dubaya]

Hi Nick, I have quite a few images of soldiers on the Somme wearing shorts especially in rear areas, I've never heard of them going over the top in them though. I believe that the use of tin plackards on the backpacks was carried on,

Jon

[haworthnick]

Thanks for that

Though it makes you wonder if they didn't go over the top in shorts why did they do so in kilts, as there didn't seem to be an awful lot of difference between the lengths of the two items of clothing. Was the retaining of the kilts more to do with the traditionalist/conservative elements within the highland regimments, becasue they can't have bee that pracitical trying to get over barbed wire and the like?

[Mark Hone]

There are plenty of pictures of New Zealanders in shorts at the Battle of Messines in June 1917.

[truthergw]

Thanks for that

Though it makes you wonder if they didn't go over the top in shorts why did they do so in kilts, as there didn't seem to be an awful lot of difference between the lengths of the two items of clothing. Was the retaining of the kilts more to do with the traditionalist/conservative elements within the highland regimments, becasue they can't have bee that pracitical trying to get over barbed wire and the like?

Traditional practice but already being criticised by the men and kilts being swapped for trousers and shorts a lot more later in the war for special purposes. Patrols and raids . Mustard gas caused a big move towards trousers. In flooded trenches as at Festubert to Armentieres area in 14-15, kilts were actually as practical as trousers if not more so.

[haworthnick]

Thanks everyone for all their answers.

Nick

[Muerrisch]

Shorts were favoured in season by 'hard' regulars, particularly those with recent India time.

Gas, and the rigours of patrolling on hands and knees made sense prevail.

[Terry Carter]

In the 1/8th Royal Warwicks 'Operation Orders' for the attack on 1 July 1916 (with the 1/6 Warwicks attached to 4th Div for the attack) it is stated that all 'Runners' to wear shorts.

Terry

[phil andrade]

And here was I thinking we might be discussing the problems of shells firing short!

If troops wore shorts, were they allowed to dispense with those puttees? They must have been a real drag, literally.

Phil.

[truthergw]

I expect they wore short puttees as worn nowadays. Really good for keeping sand out of your boots.

[Andrew Upton]

truthergw said:

I expect they wore short puttees as worn nowadays. Really good for keeping sand out of your boots.

Normally, if shorts were worn the standard long puttess would be worn, but they would be worn over knee length socks to give them something to grip to - see post 15 amongst others in the following thread to see a good example of this:

 

 

[Tom A McCluskey]

Nick,

The famous painting of 'The Charge of the 36th Ulster Division' by James Princep Beadle shows some of the Ulstermen wearing shorts in the attack. (I appreciate that this is a painting, and all that goes with this):

http://images.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=h...0GB250%26sa%3DG

The officer with his arm up, and weapon in the trail, is Lt Francis Bodenham Thornley. I believe (through an anecdote) that when he crawled back in, he was in a state due to his wounds, exacerbated by the lack of protection his shorts afforded on the long crawl back. Maybe one of the researchers of the Ulster Division can confirm or deny this. However, I will add that Lt Francis Bodenham Thornley was the advisor to the artist J P Beadle when designing this painting.

Aye

Tom McC

[montbrehain]

It was my understanding that shorts were never Issued and that all shorts that were worn (by the British at least) were cut off trousers ? Can anyone confirm this or otherwise "MO"

[auchonvillerssomme]

I expect they wore short puttees as worn nowadays. Really good for keeping sand out of your boots.

We stopped wearing puttees in about 1983, have they come back in?

Mick

[haworthnick]

What was the intended purpose of puttees, becasue it sounds like they were universally disliked?

Nick

[Joe Sweeney]

MO,

Shorts were not an issue item for the BEF, all were cut down SD trousers or unofficial brought in from elsewhere. Never sanctioned by the GHQ and in fact orders issued to stop.

In fact at wars end any man return home in possesion of shorts were to be returned to their units.

In other theatres it was different., e.g. in the EEF KD shorts were issued as a one time only issue and then the soldier had to maintain--like necessries. At first the EEF modified KD trousers.

By 1916 and 1917 KD Shorts were pattern sealed and by 1917 SD shorts were pattern sealed too.

There are are myriad amou8nt of shorts both unofficial and official available via modified trousers and official issue types.

Joe Sweeeny

[truthergw]

We stopped wearing puttees in about 1983, have they come back in?

Mick

I'm pretty sure I saw troops in Iraq wearing them. They are worn with a kilt. Kilt, boots and puttees since he cannot wear gaiters.

[montbrehain]

Thanks for clarifying that Joe , Thought you may come through with the info "MO"

[MelPack]

A fine example from the Somme 1916: