The White War: Mark Thompson

[burlington]

I bought this book yesterday as an unplanned purchase.

Anybody read it? What did you think?

Martin

[John(txic)]

An excellent read!

A few pages dragged when discussing literature and poetry, but otherwise 9 out of 10. Never has a belligerent country been despised by its allies almost as much as its enemies..... but the courage and endurance of the Italian soldier was beyond compare. Some appalling facts about how Italy treated its soldiers who had the misfortune to be taken POW; must have inspired Stalin.

[gem22]

Martin

Someone else started a thread on this book a litle while ago and most of the people who responded were quite positive about the book. Undoubtedly it was well researched and well written but I found it somewhat disappointing. I accept that I may well be in the minority here but I was looking for a book that would inform me about the fighting, battles and general conduct of the war. I was not interested in the politics, poetry and personalities.

So it was the wrong book for me. I guess I was looking for a book written in the manner that Lyn MacDonald or John Terraine wrote. I didn't get that. So I suppose I'll have to keep looking.

Garth

[Steven Broomfield]

See HERE

I must say the search function was an absolute dead loss in finding this thread.

[nigelcave]

I have to say that the most disappointing thing about the book was the maps, although the author thought they were good. I know it is difficult to enthuse publishers about maps but this book, especially given the seemingly innumerable Battles of the Isonzo, was crying out for them if sense was to be made of the text. I had to resort to buying a couple of fairly large scale road maps to sort things out in my tiny mind.

[Steven Broomfield]

Agree with that, Nigel. Woefully inadequate would be a good expression.

[David Filsell]

In my view poor mapping is a huge problem in Great War books - indeed very few books offer even adequate maps. Publishers I suspect consider them an additional and unwarranted expense - when in fact they can make or break the reader's understanding of events.

[burlington]

Hmm.

Thanks folks for all this.

As I don't know very much about this campaign, then any information is bound to be a bonus.

On the other hand, if I ignore the non-military aspects of the books eg literature, and also arm myself with some good maps, then perhaps my £9.99 will have been well spent.

HOWEVER, the book is at the end of a long queue yet to be read.

Regards

Martin

[nigelcave]

Don't get me wrong - armed with a decent map (even a modern one) this is a very useful book to read. Not least, it helps to understand the mentality motivating supporters for the war in Italy, places it in the context of the Risorgimento as an underlying theme and sets you up to understand where Mussolini came from. It is an important book, well written and manages to encapsulate neatly a whole range of issues that were of peculiar importance to Italy; as well as a very welcome look at things from the Au-H point of view. It deserves to become a classic on the subject.

My complaint was really at the mapping alone - as David says, a vital part of an intelligible read. Generally this is not the fault of the authors.

[Steven Broomfield]

Just seen a review in today's Torygraph that this book is now in paperback at £9.99.

Despite the crummy maps, it is a very good book.

[paul guthrie]

Sounding like a broken record, this is a fine book , excellent explanation of the pre war politics and fighting but even by the very low standards of WW1 books the maps are AWFUL!! Very few and just terrible, I see no excuse. Isonzo is very badly mapped and I'm resorting to using its bad maps over these TERRIBLE ones. Never seen it this bad.

Bryn Hammond's Cambrai book was the exception, quite good.

A better idea, I'm still near the start of the book, I've been to Isonzo front, that helps and I have a very good map called The isonzo front from Mt Rombon ot Mengore Hill which i'll use 1:50000 it covers the area and has a lof of inforamtion cause it's for battlefield tourists, if you buy this book you should get the map.

[paul guthrie]

Excellent book , covers the fighting quite well, Asiago & Trentino fronts as well as Isonzo and lots of things like prisoners, civilians in occupied areas of both armies, Italian nationalism & politics, the peace, all aspects of fighitng in Italy. Excellent work on the amazing brutality of the Italian Army including systematic decimation. Author blames much of the collapse at 12th Isonzo on terrible morale of troops. Also covers remarkable Italian stupidity in dealing with south slavs, in diplomacy etc. Much better than Schindler's very good Isonzo.

For another account of the brutality from a man who was there Sardinian Brigade Emilio Lussu.

[Stephen Garnett]

Hi,

I thought I would add to this by stating my own enjoyment of this book, which I bought because of the thread itself and the fact that my girlfriend's family lived (and still do) just behind the front-line. A superb introduction to the Italian front which both filled in blanks and created many more for the future. Also, an excellent synthesis of individual stories, not just used to illustrate a particular action but weaved into the fabric of the story to bring the period to life.

Perhaps I am sticking my head above the parapet here but I did wonder if the criticism of Italian Generalship was being overdone but this is only a symptom of our own revisionism and I may be very, very wrong.

Well worth a read!

Regards,

Stephen Garnett

[paul guthrie]

Just took a look at Amazon, you can buy paperback Sardinian Brigade by Lussu for next to nothing, it's really good, have read it twice and going to again.

[BigT]

It was one of those coincidences, but I read this on holiday in the area, but not knowing much about this campaign I didnt keep my eyes open and it wasnt until I was in Trieste airport on the way home that I found publicity about local events, sites and battlefield walks. There is a website ( in italian) www.prolocofoglianoredipuglia.it I agree about the maps. I think that the Isonzo battles must surely rank alongside the Somme & Verdun

[franzmaximilian]

I have just finished reading the book (in English, bought from Amazon)) only to discover that it has now been translated into Italian and is available at the bookstore round the corner....

I think it is a very good work, as it gives a general picture of Italy in the years of the Great War. This is essential for a good understanding of facts. I recommend it to anyone who wants to approach the Italian front as a preliminary reading before going deeper into the subjects or battles of his specific interest.

I agree with the opinion of most of you about the poor maps, though it is a common problem with history books.

My real critic is about the title. It is misleading to Italian readers. In the Italian perspective the White War is that fought over the highest mountain ranges, over the glaciers and permanent snows of Marmolada, Adamello and Ortles-Cevedale. This was a totally different war, of very little strategic importance indeed, but a much more "modern" one. It was fought by a few thousands, and the human factor was essential, being any success directly due to the bravery, intuition, skills and personal initiative of lower rank officers and even NCO's and privates. Totally different and even opposite to the Isonzo and Altipiani fronts, where only numbers counted. Well, the high commands were days away from the frontline in those icy areas....

I'm a bit biased, anyway. Glacial warfare is my subject and I am a member of the Società Storica per la Guerra Bianca (White War Historical Society).

Always available to contribute on my favourite subject, should anyone be interested...

[swizz]

Franz, you make a good point about the title being misleading for Italians - I hadn't thought of that. Although the title translates easily, it's one of those cases where a literal translation is not perhaps the most appropriate one!

The book gets a very brief review in the latest issue of Lo Scarpone (the magazine of the Club Alpino Italiano):

Vita e morte sul fronte italiano 1915-19 (cinquemila caduti per metro quadrato di battaglia) sulla base delle ricerche di uno storico inglese.

di Mark Thompson, Il Saggiatore, 502 pagine, 22 euro.

Swizz

[anthony osborne]

Just finished this book and having known nothing about this front in the Great War found it a very good overview and a very fascinating read - well worth getting your hands on if you can.

Ant

[rickpreston@nasuwt.net]

I have read it twice, found it excellent, indeed it has wet my apitite to visit that front.

Richard

[phil andrade]

Perhaps I am sticking my head above the parapet here but I did wonder if the criticism of Italian Generalship was being overdone but this is only a symptom of our own revisionism and I may be very, very wrong.

That comment reassures me. I, too, suspect that it carries more than a tincture of " Lions led by Donkeys" syndrome in its depiction of Italian generalship.

Perhaps the depiction is merited.....I find myself adopting a circumspect view.

Nonetheless, the book commands my respect and makes a big impact.

Phil(PJA)

[mmckay395]

I read this book earlier this year. I thought it was extremely readable and gave an excellent account of the war. It's everything you could really want in a single volume.
That being said, the maps could be better but that doesn't take away from the quality of the book.