Liz in Eastbourne Posted 11 May , 2015 Author Share Posted 11 May , 2015 In the course of revisiting my files on the Yeoman Rifles I found a list I compiled in 2012 (with the help of Geoff's famous search engine, as you couldn't do it via the CWGC website at that time) of casualties on the Thiepval Memorial from the Flers and Gird Ridge actions on the Somme. 103 at Flers, 28 at Gird Ridge (but remember these are not total casualties and the battalion was already much reduced at Gird Ridge, even with the arrival of drafts just before the action.) It might be useful to provide it here, with the caveat that there may be errors. Thiepval Memorial Pier & Face 13A &13B Yeoman Rifles: Killed in action at or died of wounds after Flers (15 September 1916) or Gird Ridge (5-10 October 1916) Flers: 15 Sept only date of action for 21/KRRC but records often say 15/17 whether KIA or DOW. Riflemen C/12307 Alcock, James Alfred C/12455 Barker, Arthur C/12457 Barker, Walter C/12399 Barrett, Leonard R/ 20585 Baxter, William Frederick C/12432 Belfield, Clarence Jenkinson Y/1051 Bland, Ernest Edward C/12802 Blomeley, Frederick George (Sjt) C/12459 Bonsall (or Bonsell) Harold C/12707 Bradbury, Norman 10 C/12500 Brodrick, Frank C/13002 Brown, Robert C/12372 Burrows, Herbert William R/20065 Butterfield, Frederick Arthur Thomas C/12318 Chapman, William Albert C/12604 Close, William Henry R/16698 Cullington, Percy William C/12467 Darling, William C/12417 Davison, Walter C/12526 Daws, Edmund 20 C/12897 Dean, Thomas Gibson R/19476 Earnshaw, Edward C/12363 Elsey, George Robert C/12873 Everingham, Percy C/12927 Feakes, Morton Herbert C/12728 Gains, Tom Y/720 Garde, Frederick C/12344 Gill, Harry C/12986 Gill, Tom Edward R/ 16704 Gooding, Ernest William 30 C/12600 Grieveson, Oliver Russell C/12260 Hainstock, Albert C/12958 Hedditch, Ernest Frank R/19397 Hill, Arthur R/20346 Holborn, James Edward C/12075 Holt, Robert Bertram C/13006 Humphrey, Edmund R/19484 Hunter, Robert Hope 5/2989 Jackson, George C/12878 James, Sydney 40 C/12696 Jones, Alfred C/12045 Kidd,John William C/12308 King, Arthur C/12595 Lambert, Robert Henry C/12159 Maxwell, William Horner C/12642 Mercer, George Henry C/13003 Milner, James Henry C/12771 Mitchell, William Lister R/19405 Morrison, William Alexander Russell C/12837 Neall, Joseph 50 C/12954 Newton, Estill R/16762 Onslow, Nathaniel C/12191 Ounsley, Ernest R/13426 Owens,Terence C/12168 Pallister, George Nelson C/12708 Parkin, Fred R/16641 Parkinson, John Thomas R/16659 Payne, Aubrey Charles 18827 Pepper, Albert Edwin C/12971 Postgate, Sidney 60 C/12661 Proctor, James Henry C/2552 Revely, George C/12428 Rhodes, Ferdinand James C/12865 Richardson, Joseph Leonard C/12497 Rowley, John Bedford C/12577 Seavers, William Thomas R/16816 Shaw, Leonard John R/20144 Sidley, Cecil Moore C/12172 Skilbeck, Francis Wilson C/12215 Smart, William 70 C/12165 Smith, Alan C/12752 Spence, William C/12864 Spraggon, John C/12833 Squibbs, Cecil Jonathan C/12669 Stawart, James C/12533 Stead, Samuel Charles C/12062 Strickland, Alonza C/12659 Sugden, Tom C/12505 Sykes, Albert C/12556 Taylor, Thomas 80 C/12149 Thompson, Harry C/12797 Thorpe, Sam C/12163 Toase, Thomas Edwin C/12375 Turner, Herbert R/120161 Vear, Percy William C/12317 Walker, Alexander Mann C/12183 Walker, Henry C/12156 Walker, Stanley C/12911 Wallace, Thomas William R/194180 Walther, Harry Theodore 90 C/12738 Webster, Charles Alfred C/12321 Welden, John Jackson R/16385 West, George Christopher C/12414 White, Thomas C/12081 White, William Donald C/12874 Whiting, Oliver R/19423 Wilkin, Edwin C/12849 Wilkinson, Frank C/12566 Winter, John Edward R/16073 Witt, Bertie 100 C/12142 Wragg, Thomas William Officers 2/Lt Benton, Frank 2/Lt Nivison, Robert Butler Gird Ridge 7 Oct 1916 including casualties just before and after the action 5-10 October. Riflemen and NCOs C/13032 Brannen, Thomas R/10826 Brown, John (CSM, B Coy) C/12823 Denison, Thomas William R/33139 Flaherty, Alexander R/22168 Freeman, William Stanley R/20736 Gray, Alexander James C/12032 Greenhill, Henry John C/12759 Island, Cyril C/12481 Jennings, Clarence Malyn C/12427 Kirbyson, Charles 10 C/12570 Longbottom, Fred C/12387 Manfield, Herbert R/11128 Marron, Andrew Joseph C/12349 Mellor, Frank R/33141 Morgan, Evan Stanley C/12449 Nicholson, Sidney C/12856 Palfreyman, John C/12955 Peers, George Stanley R/11957 Perry, Albert Edward C/12678 Pugmire, Horace/Hughes 20 C/12681 Simons, Percy (MM) R/22080 Spurgeon, Harry C/12627 Swale, Wilfred C/12972 Swales, Herbert R/18147 Swannell, George Henry Frederick C/12866 Waite, Leonard Stephenson C/12443 Williamson, Matthew C/12671 Woolley, Charles McKenzie 28 I really need to add the numbers with known graves. Liz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisharley9 Posted 11 May , 2015 Share Posted 11 May , 2015 Hi Liz Have spoken to Terry Denham about these. He has confirmed that they were not buried at the Guards Cemetery, rather these were memorial crosses brought in from the battlefield. Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz in Eastbourne Posted 11 May , 2015 Author Share Posted 11 May , 2015 Thanks, Chris, for taking the trouble, and Terry. I didn't doubt you before, I was just confused by the forms! Liz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisharley9 Posted 12 May , 2015 Share Posted 12 May , 2015 Not as much as I was confused Liz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anthony Child Posted 15 May , 2015 Share Posted 15 May , 2015 Well, that's me occupied for the next couple of weeks - many thanks again for all the help. I'll update the page with the results Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bwmp Posted 18 October , 2015 Share Posted 18 October , 2015 Lance Corporal C/12449 Sidney Nicholson is remembered on Barnsley Holgate Grammar School Old Boys Memorial, now in the Cooper Art Gallery on Church Street, Barnsley. Also on a Roll of Honour in Buckley Street & Ebenezer Chapel. The names in this little book are read out every Remembrance Sunday - on the demolition of the Ebenezer Methodist Church which had been at the junction of Sheffield and Doncaster Roads in Barnsley the names from their memorial (now presumed lost) were added to the book. Remembered too on his parent's headstone in Bansley Cemetery (Plot E.662). http://www.barnsleywarmemorials.org.uk/2014/01/barnsley-holgate-grammar-school-old-boys.html http://www.barnsleywarmemorials.org.uk/2014/08/barnsley-buckley-street-ebenezer-chapel.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz in Eastbourne Posted 18 October , 2015 Author Share Posted 18 October , 2015 Thank you for those links and pictures. I don't know if you've seen all the other references to Sidney Nicholson (and his brother), and his portrait enlarged from the B Company, 7 platoon photograph, on this thread? They are in posts: 257 on page 11 279 on page 12 281 " 283 " 328 on page 14 329 " as well as the list above of the men on the Thiepval Memorial and a good deal about the action in which he died. In fact we have much more on him here than there is on the IWM site for which the Barnsley website provides a link. Liz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest David N Posted 2 July , 2016 Share Posted 2 July , 2016 Arthur "Tiger" Pratt was my grandfather, a search for him on google resulted in me spending the last 4 hours reading this thread (although I did skip through a lot). I've searched on and off a few times for anything I could find relating to his service in WWI (something he rarely mentioned) so to see him mentioned (and pictured) on here piqued my interest again. I understand that his records were amongst those destroyed by fire, but wondered if anyone had any more info. I do have some items left to me by my mother (his daughter) including some photographs. One thing I do know beyond any doubt. is that 'granda' loved Anthony Eden and that they kept in touch for many years after the war, exchanging letters and Christmas cards - I have a number of (the then) Lord Avon's letters to my granda written on 10 Downing St notepaper. I see the last post on this thread is 8 or 9 months old so I hope someone else is still reading! I'll see if I can upload the pictures if anyone feels they would be appreciated. It's getting late here (I'm in the USA) so please excuse me for rambling. Will post again soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz in Eastbourne Posted 2 July , 2016 Author Share Posted 2 July , 2016 Yes, I'm still reading it, David - though it's luck someone alerted me to your post this morning as the recent forum upgrade meant I'd lost the thread alert, which I've now restored. I'm delighted to hear from you!  I will have to postpone a proper answer till later, but I am glad to know your grandfather loved Anthony Eden, as Eden clearly thought very highly of him.  And it would be excellent if you could let us see the pictures, either by uploading or linking to something like Photobucket.  Liz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz in Eastbourne Posted 7 July , 2016 Author Share Posted 7 July , 2016 Not connected to David's post above, but connected to a query made on a separate thread about Rifleman John Milburn, I am posting here a list of all the riflemen killed before the battalion reached the Somme. I don't think I've posted it before. Yeoman Rifles Deaths  pre-Flers (15 September 1916) England: Aldershot 1.REED  Ernest      C/12061       Bridlington  A Coy     22 February        2.BAINES Joseph Mitchell  C/12185       Thirsk  A Coy     5 April   3.KING  Fred Johnson C/12371  Barnsley    B Coy 7 Platoon  4 April  Flanders: Ploegsteert Wood 4. COLLIER John William C/12966  Helmsley   A Coy    1 June 5. HICKES  Victor Gordon C/12300  nr Helmsley A Coy   1 June 6. SEWARD Ralph  Sgt R/15612  Liverpool, Lancs (had just gained admission to Balliol College, Oxford)           but A Coy          1 June 7. BELL John William C/12726   Cleveland  A Coy ?          5 June 8. RUSHWORTH Rowland  C/12507  Huddersfield B Coy 7 Platoon  6 June 9.  MACHIN Richard Bloodworth C/12701    Boston, Lincs  D Coy 7 June 10. GOLDBERG  Herbert  C/12695 Leeds    B Coy        9 June 11. BARRETT Stephen  C/12623  Leeds     B Coy  7 Platoon  18 June 12. GREAVES Herbert Thorp   C/12617     B Coy  7 Platoon  18 June 13. VIDEAN  Stanley  C/12682   Cleveland  A Coy       20 June 14. BRIGHOUSE Charles Edwin C/13010 E.Riding but D Coy,15 Ptn 22 June 15. TRAFFORD HS  C/12262  from Stafford     D  Coy    24 June 16. CROSSLEY  Leonard C/12391 from Thirsk   A Coy   30 June 17. CROSSLEY  William  C/12390  from Thirsk   A Coy   30 June 18. AGAR H  R/20045  from Leeds    B or D Coy?         8 July 19. WILES C  R/19496  Lincolnshire  D Coy?            8 July 20. BELL  Thomas William     Leeds  B Coy C/12164    11 July 21. COLDWELL John Henry C/12890  Bradford, but D Coy  19 July 22. MILNER JH   C/12724  Malton, N. Riding  but C Coy   19 July 23. RUTHERFORD Charles C/12576      Thirsk   A Coy  19 July 24. WARD Norman C/ 12713     Ulleskelfe  B Coy  7 Platoon 19 July 25. MILBURN John  C/13022   Guisborough, N. Riding but C Coy  20 July 26. PARK  John Reginald (Sgt)   Darlington  C/12015     C Coy  20 July 27. ROCKELL HJ from Scotland (born Cheshire) D Coy   R/16707 20 July          (He had joined 21st Bn 16 June.) 28.NIXON Wilfred  C/13026  from Redcar, N. Riding but D Coy      22 July 29.WILSON CR  C/12641 born and enlisted Lincoln, living London 1915; D Coy  22 July 30. CHAPMAN John Joseph from Hawes, Yorkshire  B Coy  C/12999   26 July 31. ELVES   JF  C/12753  from Spennymoor, Co. Durham originally C Coy, 9 Platoon, but Eden wrote the letter to his family (info supplied by GWF member in Durham) and said he had moved to Machine Gun Corps.  16 August 32. TURNBULL  Walter  C/12487  from Guisborough  A Coy       25 August  Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz in Eastbourne Posted 15 September , 2016 Author Share Posted 15 September , 2016 (edited) On the centenary of the battle of Flers-Courcelette, I hope others will be remembering the Yeoman Rifles. Â All the men who died there are listed on this thread, whether commemorated on the Thiepval Memorial or in cemeteries in the area, but many others suffered terrible wounds. Â I am on my way to North Yorkshire where on Saturday there will be a commemorative event in Helmsley, and look forward to meeting descendants and people with an interest in the battalion there. Â Liz Edited 15 September , 2016 by Liz in Eastbourne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michaeljohn Posted 19 September , 2016 Share Posted 19 September , 2016 I was also at the commemorative event on Saturday, I am the son of C/12514 Rifleman F J Kneeshaw pictured on the 'Countess' photo. I have struggled to find any information about him. Kew told me a few years ago when I visited that a lot of records were lost in a fire during WW2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz in Eastbourne Posted 19 September , 2016 Author Share Posted 19 September , 2016 Hello Michaeljohn I've just posted on the other thread, having come back from Yorkshire this evening.  I looked on Ancestry to see if your father's military record had survived, but no luck - as they told you at Kew, a lot of service records, I think about two-thirds, were destroyed in WW2. The medal roll doesn't show him as being in any other battalion, as a lot of men were after 21/KRRC were disbanded in March 1918, or after they had been wounded and had to spend time in hospital and convalescing. It may not be possible to find anything definite but we could make some guesses.  As he is on the Countess photo and is from the estate or nearby, he was presumably in A Company.  Liz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 9 October , 2016 Share Posted 9 October , 2016 Hello I am related to Allen and Ted Tindall. My grandmother is related. Arthur Sutcliffe Tindall is on her mother's side. Hello I am related to Allen and Ted Tindall. My grandmother is related. Arthur Sutcliffe Tindall is on her mother's side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 9 October , 2016 Share Posted 9 October , 2016 (edited) Were my relatives : Allan, Ted and Harry Tindall. 7 Platoon 21st division Yeomans Rifles? They had more brothers- Douglas, Clifford and Howard/Arthur. Strangely I was born in Aldershot- mother and father both army!  Edited 9 October , 2016 by Guest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jane Heyburn Posted 10 October , 2016 Share Posted 10 October , 2016 Hi, First attempt - here goes Been reading trough this topic and thought I ought to add my Grandfather William (Bill) Todd.  He enlisted the Yeoman Rifles in September 1915 C/12048.  He lived in Bilsdale and I think worked for Lord Feversham as a tenant farmer. He survived the war and ended is service at the rank of Warrant Officer II, Company Quartermaster Sergeant.  He then moved to Darlington to work at North Road Railway works.  He used to attend the reunions at Helmsley until his death in 1980.  My father went to the last reunion in September 1994 were he got the book by Gerald Dennis, signed by Michael Hicks. I have a photo of my grandfather both as a young man in uniform and with others attending the reunions.  I am sure that this is known but there are other photos on the Helmsley archive site. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MBrockway Posted 10 October , 2016 Share Posted 10 October , 2016 3 hours ago, Jane Heyburn said: I am sure that this is known but there are other photos on the Helmsley archive site. Â ... which is here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MBrockway Posted 10 October , 2016 Share Posted 10 October , 2016 3 hours ago, Jane Heyburn said: Hi, First attempt - here goes Been reading trough this topic and thought I ought to add my Grandfather William (Bill) Todd.  He enlisted the Yeoman Rifles in September 1915 C/12048.  He lived in Bilsdale and I think worked for Lord Feversham as a tenant farmer. He survived the war and ended is service at the rank of Warrant Officer II, Company Quartermaster Sergeant.  He then moved to Darlington to work at North Road Railway works.  He used to attend the reunions at Helmsley until his death in 1980.  My father went to the last reunion in September 1994 were he got the book by Gerald Dennis, signed by Michael Hicks. I have a photo of my grandfather both as a young man in uniform and with others attending the reunions.  I am sure that this is known but there are other photos on the Helmsley archive site.  Bill Todd's BW & VM roll entry. He went out as a Colour Serjeant and, as you say, ended the war as CQMS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz in Eastbourne Posted 10 October , 2016 Author Share Posted 10 October , 2016 (edited) On 10/9/2016 at 12:21, H singleton said: Were my relatives : Allan, Ted and Harry Tindall. 7 Platoon 21st division Yeomans Rifles? They had more brothers- Douglas, Clifford and Howard/Arthur. Strangely I was born in Aldershot- mother and father both army!  Hello - Harry , killed at Flers, and his cousin Allan, were in 7 Platoon of 21st Battalion KRRC, known as the Yeoman Rifles (sorry for spelling that out pedantically but  the division is a much larger entity and the battalion was in 41st Division). I think Ted was Allan's brother, wasn't he? I 'll have to check whether Ted was in the YRs, it's so long since I researched them, but have you searched for 'Tindall' on this thread? There's quite a lot, including some very interesting material from Cravendale. I expect you saw this about the 7 Platoon photograph. EDIT  It doesn't appear that Ted was in 21/KRRC. Liz Edited 10 October , 2016 by Liz in Eastbourne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz in Eastbourne Posted 10 October , 2016 Author Share Posted 10 October , 2016 (edited) 23 hours ago, Jane Heyburn said: Hi, First attempt - here goes Been reading trough this topic and thought I ought to add my Grandfather William (Bill) Todd.  He enlisted the Yeoman Rifles in September 1915 C/12048.  He lived in Bilsdale and I think worked for Lord Feversham as a tenant farmer. He survived the war and ended is service at the rank of Warrant Officer II, Company Quartermaster Sergeant.  He then moved to Darlington to work at North Road Railway works.  He used to attend the reunions at Helmsley until his death in 1980.  My father went to the last reunion in September 1994 were he got the book by Gerald Dennis, signed by Michael Hicks. I have a photo of my grandfather both as a young man in uniform and with others attending the reunions.  I am sure that this is known but there are other photos on the Helmsley archive site.  Hi Jane Thank you for adding your grandfather to the thread. Would you be willing to post his photograph here?  You see I think he's on the 'Countess' photograph, which would make sense if he was a tenant of the Earl's.  He was certainly an early recruit. You may have a copy of this - we have it here on p 4 of this thread, thanks to Mark.  There's a Todd on the right of the second-to-back row, I don't think the initial is right but there were errors in the caption.  Three weeks ago I went to the Ryedale Family History Group's research room at Hovingham, thanks to Peter Braithwaite, who let us all know about the Flers centenary event at Helmsley and also showed me the material they have on 21/KRRC (and many other aspects of family history).  i think Bilsdale is a separate dale adjoining it, isn't it?  but it's so close that they might well be interested in your grandfather's story, too. Yes I did know about the Helmsley website but I don't think we'd got a link here till Mark just posted it - thanks for mentioning it.  Liz Edited 11 October , 2016 by Liz in Eastbourne Insert link to photograph. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jane Heyburn Posted 10 October , 2016 Share Posted 10 October , 2016 Hi Liz Will be pleased to post photo, might take a day or two while I figure out how! Â I also have a copy of the Countess picture. Â On mine my grandfather is named as L/Cpl W. Todd and is standing on second row last on right, on the one on Pg 4 he is named as W Ford. Â If you go back to the original on the Helmsley site he is named as Todd not Ford! Â Confusing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jane Heyburn Posted 10 October , 2016 Share Posted 10 October , 2016 Hi Mark  As you said GF is 2nd row from the front, mis-named  (to me) as Ford.   Jane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz in Eastbourne Posted 11 October , 2016 Author Share Posted 11 October , 2016 (edited) Thanks, Mark, I will go back and do that. Another error was 'Porter' for Potter, next to the Countess on her right, whose biography was extensively researched on this thread. And thanks, Jane, for your confirmation of your grandfather's identity on the photograph.  Liz Edited 11 October , 2016 by Liz in Eastbourne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MBrockway Posted 11 October , 2016 Share Posted 11 October , 2016 (edited) 17 hours ago, Jane Heyburn said: Hi Liz Will be pleased to post photo, might take a day or two while I figure out how!  I also have a copy of the Countess picture.  On mine my grandfather is named as L/Cpl W. Todd and is standing on second row last on right, on the one on Pg 4 he is named as W Ford.  If you go back to the original on the Helmsley site he is named as Todd not Ford!  Confusing! Jane, Photo annotation text now corrected. Also the error on Lt Potter of which Liz has advised above. I've also deleted some of my recent posts to de-clutter the topic. This has left some 'orphan' replies from other Pals, but sense and flow of the topic still coherent.  Edited 11 October , 2016 by MBrockway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jane Heyburn Posted 12 October , 2016 Share Posted 12 October , 2016 Hi Uploading picture of W. Todd as promised (attached). Jane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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