Guest donnababycatcher Posted 28 August , 2004 Share Posted 28 August , 2004 Hello all found a link to this site on Rootschat family history site and thought I would see if I could get some more info on my Grandad. His name was William Henry Soundie and he was born in April 1890 and enlisted in the army on 1/2/1909. The details from an old card my mum had were Royal Regiment of Artillery army number ?55304 RH and RFA. I have checked on the London Gazette site and he is mentioned in a supplement on 16/7/1918 (although number is 55364) and so is his brother Richard in 12/6/1918. The medal index for S is not online as yet so cannot view that but wondered if anyone had any info on where he might have served. My mum has some postcard type photos from both France and Germany if they would be any help. We also have a letter dated 1954 awarding him the Imperial Service Medal and I wondered what that would be awarded for so long after the war. Hope this is enough info for you I have heard great things about how knowledgeable this site is. William is the one on the far right of the picture at the front (which I hope has worked ) Donna Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackblue Posted 29 August , 2004 Share Posted 29 August , 2004 Hi Donna, There are a couple of artillery experts on the forum, Dick Flory for one, who may be able to assist with his numbers. I understand that some numbers were issued on a unit to unit basis in the artillery but many were not. Early in the war there were essentially three different artillery organisations RHA - Royal Horse Artillery, RFA - Royal Field Artillery and RGA - Royal Garrison Artiilery. This generally referred to the size and role of their guns. These units all came under the ambit of the Royal Regiment of Artillery. On Medal Index Cards you will often see men initially listed as RFA, RHA of RGA and then as RA. Is the card you have a postcard...it sounds like a Medal Index Card so perhaps your mum has already done some research. If that is the case the entry on the card you have is probably RA as opposed to RH? This link will tell you more. http://www.1914-1918.net/cra.htm As you are probably aware the London Gazette entries indicate that they were both awarded the Military Medal for 'Bravery in the Field'. The following link will tell you more about the medal. http://homepages.tesco.net/~medals/mm.htm The Imperial Service Medal was awarded for 25 years civil service so he would likely have received this for his civilian occupation. My great uncle was awarded one for serving 25 years as a Postal Officer. http://www.odm.org.uk/uk/imperial_service_medal.htm He does appear to have quite a few ribbons which means the photo was most likely taken after the end of he war. He also appears to have 2 x good conduct chevrons on his left sleeve. Regards Tim D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackblue Posted 29 August , 2004 Share Posted 29 August , 2004 There are also overseas service stripes on his right arm. I think there may be 5? There was a red one awarded for 1914 and blue ones for each year after that. THis would indicate that he entered a theatre of war in 1914 meaning he was probably a member of the BEF. I can't see any rank which probably means he finished the war as a Gunner although he may have served ten continuous years from 1909. Can you post a scan of the card you have? TD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve chilton Posted 29 August , 2004 Share Posted 29 August , 2004 Hi Donna Cant help with your query but welcome to the forum. Steve Chilton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest donnababycatcher Posted 29 August , 2004 Share Posted 29 August , 2004 Wow you can tell that much from that photo. He did work in the Post Office from when the war ended until he retired so that explains that letter. This is one of the postcards which I think has his brother on. CD with old photos on won't work at the minute so am limited which ones can be sent. The card my mum had was some kind of army registration card giving details of the date he entered and his age and address not a medal card mum has done no research at all. He was 52 when she was born and died when she was 16 so doesn't know much about his army days as he didn't talk about it. Donna Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest donnababycatcher Posted 29 August , 2004 Share Posted 29 August , 2004 here is another one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackblue Posted 29 August , 2004 Share Posted 29 August , 2004 Hi Donna, If you can post a scan of the documents you have and what notations are on the photographs this will help a great deal. They are fantastic photos and I am sure we all look forward to seeing the rest of them. Regards Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest donnababycatcher Posted 29 August , 2004 Share Posted 29 August , 2004 Finally managed to get this to load. This picture is almost black in real life but comes up great when enhanced. I never knew he had red hair till then. Now mum says this was painted in France early on in the war but given that he has his medals on and am I right in thinking the star was not awarded until 1918 it has to be later doesn't it? Also does anyone know what the ribbons are for. I have looked on line but cannot find any that seem to match. Donna Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest donnababycatcher Posted 29 August , 2004 Share Posted 29 August , 2004 This is a photo of him with a good friend of his who was a concientious objector. I have scanned both front and back as it has an address on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest donnababycatcher Posted 29 August , 2004 Share Posted 29 August , 2004 oops need the photo too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackblue Posted 29 August , 2004 Share Posted 29 August , 2004 Hi Donna, Fantastic picture. The ribbons are the Military Medal, 1914 of 1914/15 Star, British War Medal and what I believe is supposed to be the Victory Medal. The colours of the Victory Medal are somewhat different in reality...probably somewhat harder to paint. Look at the WW1 medals at the following link. http://www.worldmedals.co.uk/Rib/Britrib/britribb.htm The collar badges and uniform seem consistent with Royal Artillery. As far as I know the War Medal and Victory Medal were generally not issued until about 1921. Regards Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackblue Posted 29 August , 2004 Share Posted 29 August , 2004 Donna, The card lists his unit as 130th Battery, RFA I think. R***shill Barracks. Hopefully one of our resident artillery experts can give you more information. May be worth bearing in mind that the medals or ribbons could have been painted into the photograph afterwards. Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest donnababycatcher Posted 29 August , 2004 Share Posted 29 August , 2004 Sorry to sound so dim but what is the difference between the ribbons and the actual medals. Did the men wear the ribbons for everyday wear and keep the actual medals for special occasions ( I suppose they wouldn't be very practical in battlefields). If these medals were not issued till later then this must be a later picture than mum thinks. Mum also remembers that he had a "whole chest full of medals" would she be remembering him wearing all the medals that correspond to these ribbons (needless to say the medals have long disappeared and family members all deny any knowledge of being given them ) Have looked at that ribbon site before but still can't seem to match them up so will have to wait till his medal card comes online. Am trying to sort out the photos but had to borrow them from mum once on pain of death if I let anything happen to them and unfortunately don't seem to have scanned the backs of the ones I have already sent. Will ask her if anything is on them. Can I find out when he left the army? I know he married in 1929 and have a couple of photos dated 1927/8 with my nan pre-marriage so assume he was out by then. Sorry for all the questions I feel I know very little about something that was such a big part of history. Donna Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackblue Posted 29 August , 2004 Share Posted 29 August , 2004 Hi Donna, Try clicking on The Long. Long Trail icon on the top left of the page and go to Grandad's War. I didn"t realise but it does have photo's of the medals you are seeking including gallantry medals. Have a good troll through as there is a lot of information there that is far better explained than I can accomplish here. There were different orders of dress as far as medals go. For everyday wear they would wear ribbons only. For ceremonial dress or formal occasions they would wear the full medals. Your photo with him wearing both medals and ribbons is a little unusual. It perhaps indicates that he had been issued his Military Medal and Star but had yet to be issued his British War Medal and Victory Medal. I think in most cases that the stars were issued before the other service medals so this may place the photo as about 1919 or 1920. If he stayed in the army after the war he may have received long service medals and possibly participated in other campaigns. If he served after 1921 you can write to the Ministry of Defence who will hold his service papers. Ensure you state what details you have and that you are his Next of Kin. Look at this link. His service papers should give some details regarding his WW1 service. http://www.mod.uk/aboutus/military/records/army.htm TD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest donnababycatcher Posted 29 August , 2004 Share Posted 29 August , 2004 Thank you so much for the information i will go and have a good read and decide what to do next. Donna Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilB Posted 29 August , 2004 Share Posted 29 August , 2004 Donna, bear in mind that the photo was probably coloured by hand. I have one of me in about 1942 and there is a tie painted on, although I wasn`t wearing one. So don`t bank on his having red hair, and be prepared to make allowance for artistic licence! Phil B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest donnababycatcher Posted 29 August , 2004 Share Posted 29 August , 2004 no the red hair is throughout the family I just never realised he had it as well. I had only ever seen black and white photos of him as an old man before. I have just spent several hours reading through all the info on the long long trail and feel very humble about how little I knew. A few years ago we visited a War Cemetery in France that we just came across whilst out driving I think it was near Arras it was a very beautiful and well kept place which spookily despite the traffic seemed perfectly quiet once you went through the gates. Looking though the London gazette again I have found another mention of him in 1922 getting some kind of raise or job improvement (what is the correct word) within the Post Office so he had obviously left by then which narrows it down. Donna Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackblue Posted 29 August , 2004 Share Posted 29 August , 2004 Had another look at medal ribbons and the last one could be the 1911 Coronation Medal. I am unsure of the criteria nd whether he would have been eligible though. He was in the army then so perhaps it is a possibility. TD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackblue Posted 30 August , 2004 Share Posted 30 August , 2004 Yes Donna, What has the photo of the guys in front of building got written on it across the bottom? I blew it up but it's too blurry to tell. Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest donnababycatcher Posted 2 September , 2004 Share Posted 2 September , 2004 Sorry about delay been busy at work. I can't read what the photo says either may have to go back to original and try again. Although I seem to remember I couldn't make it out there either. Have been reading again the description of overseas stripes and good conduct chevrons mentioned by Tim but looking at photo they seem to be on the sleeves of the guy in the centre whereas my grandad is the one on the right with the cooks hand on his shoulder. I don't think I can see any stripes on his sleeves can I? Donna Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest AmericanDoughboy Posted 2 September , 2004 Share Posted 2 September , 2004 Welcome Donna, You sure to have many resources within your research upon your relatives at war. I must say that I will look forward to speaking with you about the events of The Great War and I hope to conversate ideas and interests within the subject. Hopes and Regards, -Doughboy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackblue Posted 2 September , 2004 Share Posted 2 September , 2004 Sorry about delay been busy at work. I can't read what the photo says either may have to go back to original and try again. Although I seem to remember I couldn't make it out there either. Have been reading again the description of overseas stripes and good conduct chevrons mentioned by Tim but looking at photo they seem to be on the sleeves of the guy in the centre whereas my grandad is the one on the right with the cooks hand on his shoulder. I don't think I can see any stripes on his sleeves can I? Donna Definitely there Donna. The service stripes are faint and you can only see the ends of the conduct chevrons. Regards Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest donnababycatcher Posted 5 September , 2004 Share Posted 5 September , 2004 Have been back to mum and although she can't lay her hands on the photo at this moment she has lent me Grandads Small Book which lists his army career and medals received (she never told me about this before) and also his war diary. This is about 4 inches by 2.5 inches and written mostly in pencil so is very faded. It describes daily what is going on. The first entry is 17th Sept 1916 and the last May 17th 1917. Mum has asked me to try and copy it out before it gets too faded to read so will try to do so this week. I can post it on here when done if anyone is interested. By the way he has listed in his small book the 1914 star with Bar, the Military Medal, the British War Medal and the Victory Medal Donna Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morval Ross Posted 6 September , 2004 Share Posted 6 September , 2004 Hi Donna, Welcome to the forum, Hope you will enjoy this forum as much as I do. Ross. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackblue Posted 6 September , 2004 Share Posted 6 September , 2004 Hi Donna, Would be interesed in whatever you have learnt including unit etc. Regards Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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