AthollHighlander Posted 2 October , 2004 Share Posted 2 October , 2004 My Great Great Uncle died in Bedford 1919 and was buried in Cromdale Scotland where he was born. I've searched on the CWGC site but no trace of his details. My information is scarce but my cousin thinks he died in a military hospital. The only likely hospital I can find is Woburn Military hospital but the memorial shown on the roll of honour website mentions only 16 NCOs and men but no trace of my relative. Looked on the Long, Long Trail site but no mention of a military Hospital in Bedford at all that I can find. Is there a site I could search for men who died after 1918 back in the UK? Any advise gratefully received Atholl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Saunders Posted 2 October , 2004 Share Posted 2 October , 2004 Do you have a copy of his death certificate? Is it possible he may have been discharged from service prior to his death - does he have a CWGC headstone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CROONAERT Posted 3 October , 2004 Share Posted 3 October , 2004 Try the obituaries in the local newspapers for both Bedford and Cromdale for around the time of his death if you can. This is probably your best source of information. Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AthollHighlander Posted 3 October , 2004 Author Share Posted 3 October , 2004 Do you have a copy of his death certificate? Is it possible he may have been discharged from service prior to his death - does he have a CWGC headstone? Good questions. I've maybe put the cart before the horse asking for advice but just got the bare bones this week and anxious to find out more info. Will take your advice on board. I've now been told there is another plaque or memorial either CWGC or Legion but going thru to Cromdale to see first hand., and will obtain D/C (obvious when pointed out, will also give cause of death) Many thanks for taking the time to post back Atholl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AthollHighlander Posted 3 October , 2004 Author Share Posted 3 October , 2004 Try the obituaries in the local newspapers for both Bedford and Cromdale for around the time of his death if you can. Dave Nice one. As advised will contact Strathspey and Badenoch Herald re archives. Local paper dedicated to the area so hopeful I can find something. Thanks, advise always taken on board as this is a bit of a learning curve. Atholl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Denham Posted 3 October , 2004 Share Posted 3 October , 2004 Atholl If you give us his name, we may be able to help more. If he died in service before 31.08.21 he should be on CWGC and possibly so even if he died after discharge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AthollHighlander Posted 3 October , 2004 Author Share Posted 3 October , 2004 Terry I have some unconfirmed information regarding his name which may explain my difficulty in tracing him. The 1901 census shows a John McDonald age 6 along with his family members including my great grandmother. My cousin tells me my G/G brother was named William! was born 1885 and died 1919 at Bedford (exact location unknown). We are currently trying to establish whether we are talking about the same person, and was in fact William John but known to his family as John as his father was also called William. Will visit his grave at Cromdale next week to establish what is written on the stone and hopefully it will reveal with whom he served. Searches under the name permutations have failed to trace him to date but as the information I currently have is minimal and conflicting it is perhaps unsurprising. Found one possible match on the CWGC site matching William and age but that souls parents were from Glasgow not Cromdale area where my relatives stayed at that time. This is why I omitted his personal details from my original enquiry as I hoped to clarify the basic information before confusing anyone else... Hope the above makes some sense. Atholl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Lewis Posted 3 October , 2004 Share Posted 3 October , 2004 Atholl Ive looked on 1837 online for the year 1919 and could not find your John or William Mcdonald recorded via 1901 census. The closest ones were a John (25) recorded in Elham and a William (24) recorded in Blackburn. Taking he was born in 1885 the closest Ive found are two John's both 35 one recorded Kildenhall the other Lincoln Regards Doug. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AthollHighlander Posted 3 October , 2004 Author Share Posted 3 October , 2004 Ive looked on 1837 online Thanks Doug but am I not right in thinking 1837 online is solely the England & Wales indexes? Atholl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Lewis Posted 3 October , 2004 Share Posted 3 October , 2004 Atholl Bedford is in England,it's the place of death that is recorded not the nationality of the person. Regards Doug. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bedfordyeoman Posted 3 October , 2004 Share Posted 3 October , 2004 Atholl, The local newspaper for Bedford was the Bedfordshire Times. I'll see what I can dig up for you. All the best David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Denham Posted 3 October , 2004 Share Posted 3 October , 2004 I've searched on the CWGC site but no trace of his details. Atholl Have I misunderstood? Here are his details from CWGC. Name: McDONALD Initials: W Nationality: United Kingdom Rank: Private Regiment: Cameron Highlanders Unit Text: 4th Bn. Date of Death: 28/12/1914 Service No: 1828 Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead Grave/Memorial Reference: 173. Cemetery: CROMDALE PARISH CHURCHYARD or is this someone else? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AthollHighlander Posted 3 October , 2004 Author Share Posted 3 October , 2004 Have I misunderstood? Here are his details from CWGC. Name: McDONALD Initials: W Nationality: United Kingdom Rank: Private Regiment: Cameron Highlanders Unit Text: 4th Bn. Date of Death: 28/12/1914 Service No: 1828 Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead Grave/Memorial Reference: 173. Cemetery: CROMDALE PARISH CHURCHYARD or is this someone else? Terry you're a genius. I've assumed the information passed to me was correct which was he died in 1919 but this may have been an error. I've searched on that basis without broadening my search. This certainly looks like a positive result but will enquire further to be certain. I know that the majority of records were destroyed during WW11 but is there a site online I can go to enquire? My only reservation might be that both William and McDonald were very common names in the area at that time however the fact he was buried in Cromdale gives me great hope. My first opportunity to visit my relatives grave will be next monday which may well verify this information. Many many thanks for your efforts and to all who responded with valuable advice. Atholl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRIAN TALMER Posted 3 October , 2004 Share Posted 3 October , 2004 From Soldiers Died: Queen's Own Cameron Highlanders 4th Bn 1828 McDonald - William Born: Cromdale, Grantown Morayshire Enlisted: Inverness Resided: Advie, Morayshire Died 28/12/1914 Theatre of war: Home I checked the online MIC on the PRO website with no luck but keep trying as they are adding more details all the time. You will then be able to download a copy of his medal index card. http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/searchourcollections/ Hope this helps Lesley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AthollHighlander Posted 3 October , 2004 Author Share Posted 3 October , 2004 Lesley Many thanks for that looks fairly certain now this is my Great Great Uncle as the family did reside in Advie. Atholl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Denham Posted 3 October , 2004 Share Posted 3 October , 2004 If he died in UK without going abroad (likely as he died in 1914), he would not be entitled to any campaign medals and therefore would not have a MIC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jemimajane Posted 4 October , 2004 Share Posted 4 October , 2004 Checked 1837online.com and found the following deaths: William MacDonald Age 20 Bedford Registration district Ref 3b 570 March 1915 quarter William MacDonald age 21 Bedford Registration district Ref 3b 360 December 1914 quarter I know they're for "MacDonald" rather than McDonald but any information may be of help - even for the purpose of elimination. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve fuller Posted 4 October , 2004 Share Posted 4 October , 2004 If you get no joy on the Bedford searches mate, email me & Ill have a nose for it when I go a looking later this month. Cheers Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bedfordyeoman Posted 4 October , 2004 Share Posted 4 October , 2004 Atholl, It looks like, between us all, we are getting nearer to resolving this one. Large numbers of Scots territorials "invaded" Bedford in 1914, including the Gordons, Camerons, Seaforths and Argylls. I know nothing about the doings of the Scots Regiments in WW1 but I do know that all those that were stationed in Bedford had gone into action between about February and May 1915. The Bedfordshire Times published long casualty lists and the Scots were given as much prominence as the county regiment; Bedford certainly took to them. The Northern Scot newspaper said in May 1915 "We believe the 6th Seaforths had a great send-off from the kindly people of Bedford who had come to have a great liking for the men from the Highlands. Our boys, we are glad to think, conducted themselves like soldiers and gentlemen and made many friends during their eight months' stay in the town. How far away it seems from those warm days in August when the train steamed out of Elgin station almost in silence, bearing away the Territorials to some strange adventure. The adventure has now begun in real earnestness and we may expect stirring news in the near future" Unfortunately, a number of the lads died of various illnesses, accidents etc whilst stationed in Bedford and a good few of them are buried in Bedford cemetery. Now that we have a clear date of death, I'll see what the Bedfordshire Times mentioned, if anything. All the best David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bedfordyeoman Posted 4 October , 2004 Share Posted 4 October , 2004 Dear All, My bit of research on Atholl's query has brought an unexpected lead. I just happened to notice while trawling through the Bedford cemetery records an entry for William Batley Kingston who died on 3/11/18, shown as a rifleman with the Rifle Brigade. Born and enlisted Bedford (I assume this last information is from SDGW). I thought this strange because I knew I had an entry for the same name but as a Bedford Yeoman who was commissioned to the MGC(Cavalry) in 1917 and is shown in the voters list in 1918 as a 2/Lt in the Tank Corps. He was Bedford born and bred. I checked the London Gazette with no luck and the only entry at the National Archives for an MIC is WB Kingston with the Tank Corps, which confirms the voters list. No MIC for WBK's Rifle Brigade number or name. It has to be the same chap, surely ? So, how does a 2/Lt in the Tank Corps become a ranker in the Rifle Brigade ? Does anyone have an army lists which might shed some light on the matter ? I'll check the local paper for death notices etc but any thoughts would be appreciated. All the best David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AthollHighlander Posted 4 October , 2004 Author Share Posted 4 October , 2004 It looks like, between us all, we are getting nearer to resolving this one. You can say that again!! This is an education and very much appreciated. Thats a gem of information and thanks to JemimaJane also as the age given although differs from what I thought may just have solved a mystery in the William or John puzzle as I may have been giving him his older brothers age. Despite me throwing in so many red herrings (unwittingly I have to say) you guys have come up trumps. Thanks to all and good luck with the BedfordYeoman David I've every faith you'll get to the bottom of it, surely worth a thread of its own. I'm afraid as a novice researcher I'm not qualified to advise but will monitor with interest. Atholl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bedfordyeoman Posted 5 October , 2004 Share Posted 5 October , 2004 Atholl, Good news ! The Bedfordshire Times of 1/1/15 carries an article about the deaths of several of the Scots over the Christmas period and our man is mentioned. There appears to have been outbreaks of measles and pneumonia at the time and he died from the latter after contracting measles (death certificate will confirm). There's a note of the hospital where he died and that a company of Camerons escorted his body to the railway station for onward carriage. It's a brief but nice article and, if you can e-mail me your address, I'll post it to you. No luck with my man, however. Just a note of his death in the classifieds confirming his death at Falmouth Military Hospital. It is the same chap, however, so I now just need solve the mystery of how his commission came to an end and he re-enlisted. If anybody has access to the Cornish Guardian or whatever the relevant newspaper for that part of Cornwall was at the time and can confirm any details I will be mightily grateful ! All the best David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AthollHighlander Posted 6 October , 2004 Author Share Posted 6 October , 2004 if you can e-mail me your address, I'll post it to you. emailed address and again many thanks David., and to all. My cousin has visited his grave and confirmed that this is the same William McDonald. and is buried beside my great grandmother, his older sister. Atholl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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