Uncle George Posted 26 August , 2016 Share Posted 26 August , 2016 1 minute ago, neverforget said: I have a feeling it might be D.L.G. probably referring to Haig's blind faith in Charteris' intelligence? Yes, and yes. Too easy, I suppose. Who's this then ? ? ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knotty Posted 26 August , 2016 Share Posted 26 August , 2016 That's Sir Phillip Sassoon,Haig's private secretary,after the war an MP,died young at the age of 50. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fattyowls Posted 26 August , 2016 Share Posted 26 August , 2016 Curses! At long last Charteris is one I could have got and I was out. It might be months before another comes along (a photo or a quote that I recognise that is, not me going out). Fab quote UG, sums up what I suspected beautifully. I think I saw a thread asking about a biography, it would be an interesting read if such a thing exists. Pete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle George Posted 26 August , 2016 Share Posted 26 August , 2016 (edited) Phillip Sassoon it is: How about this ? ? ? "[He] chain-smoked cigarettes by day and night, allowing himself little time to eat and no time to rest, he wore his body to a shadow. The time came when the clouds came, the tensions relaxed and the miracle of salvation intervened. [He] said he would go for a bathe. His chauffeur drove him to Berck Plage, and the general went down to the sea alone. No one saw the manner of his end. His body was recovered from the sea some time later." Edited 26 August , 2016 by Uncle George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knotty Posted 26 August , 2016 Share Posted 26 August , 2016 UG, just going through some references to Charteris and it looks to refer to his replacement, one Brig.Gen Edward Cox, who drowned in August 1918, shortly after the German Spring Offensives. May have been suicide! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Clifton Posted 26 August , 2016 Share Posted 26 August , 2016 It is indeed Brig-Gen Cox, who is buried at Etaples. Personally I think it unlikely that he committed suicide: when he died the tide of the war had turned substantially in the Allies' favour, so the outlook was good. I think it more likely that the release of the strain he had been under earlier in the year caused him to have a heart attack or stroke while swimming. Ron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Upton Posted 27 August , 2016 Share Posted 27 August , 2016 3 hours ago, Ron Clifton said: It is indeed Brig-Gen Cox, who is buried at Etaples. Personally I think it unlikely that he committed suicide: when he died the tide of the war had turned substantially in the Allies' favour, so the outlook was good. I think it more likely that the release of the strain he had been under earlier in the year caused him to have a heart attack or stroke while swimming. Ron It's very strange, if Knotty hadn't got there first I would have known the answer too, as I recently acquired a copy of his memoir which came with a possibly unique insert... https://postimg.org/image/dff5l6321/ https://postimg.org/image/buio853o3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle George Posted 27 August , 2016 Share Posted 27 August , 2016 This attached clip is from 'Haig's Intelligence: GHQ and the German Army 1916-1918' (2013), by Jim Beach. Ll.G does not mention Cox's death in his 'Memoirs'. However, when writing of the Spring Offensive he quotes Peter Wright's 'At the Supreme War Council': "General Cox, of G.H.Q. Intelligence, not only gave the exact area of the attack [...] but tipped the exact date on 20th or 21st March." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle George Posted 27 August , 2016 Share Posted 27 August , 2016 Another pen portrait from Ll.G: "The whole atmosphere of this secluded little community reeked of that sycophantic optimism which is the curse of autocratic power in every form. [...] As for [this man], he had the air of a silent craftsman, whose plans, designed and worked out by his art in the seclusion of his workshop, were turning out well and proceeding inexorably without a hitch to the destined end." Who is he describing ? ? ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knotty Posted 27 August , 2016 Share Posted 27 August , 2016 (edited) The first part of this is probably the whole of the GHQ in France, the individual I need to do some more research. Back later. Returned with General Launcelot Kiggell as the person being "critisied" Edited 27 August , 2016 by Knotty Added the extra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle George Posted 27 August , 2016 Share Posted 27 August , 2016 (edited) 9 hours ago, Knotty said: The first part of this is probably the whole of the GHQ in France, the individual I need to do some more research. Back later. Returned with General Launcelot Kiggell as the person being "critisied" Correct on both counts. Ll.G is describing what he sees as Kiggell's "complacent optimism about Passchendaele". It is always enlightening to read of Ll.G's opinion about his generals. Here he is on what came to be described as 'chateau generalship': "The men on the heights offered no encouragement or chances to genius down below. The distance between the chateaux and dugouts was as great as that from the fixed stars to the caverns of earth. No telescope was powerful enough to discern talent at that depth, even if a look-out were being kept." Edited 27 August , 2016 by Uncle George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle George Posted 27 August , 2016 Share Posted 27 August , 2016 (edited) " [...] Needless to say he never rose in the War above the rank of Colonel. I met him during the Peace Conference and he struck me as being one of the ablest and most successful brains I had met in any army. That was quite sufficient to make him suspect and to hinder his promotion to the highest ranks of his profession." Who has gained Ll.G's approval ? ? ? He is not TEL. Edited 27 August , 2016 by Uncle George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neverforget Posted 27 August , 2016 Share Posted 27 August , 2016 13 minutes ago, Uncle George said: " [...] Needless to say he never rose in the War above the rank of Colonel. I met him during the Peace Conference and he struck me as being one of the ablest and most successful brains I had met in any army. That was quite sufficient to make him suspect and to hinder his promotion to the highest ranks of his profession." Who has gained Ll.G's approval ? ? ? He is not TEL. I think I know this one. The one and only Richard Meinertzhagen? Love L.G. "chateau generalship" quotes. I have his memoirs, and they are a terrific read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle George Posted 27 August , 2016 Share Posted 27 August , 2016 8 minutes ago, neverforget said: I think I know this one. The one and only Richard Meinertzhagen? Love L.G. "chateau generalship" quotes. I have his memoirs, and they are a terrific read. Yes, Meinertzhagen, no stranger to WiT. Ll.G's 'Memoirs' are hugely entertaining. The index on its own is worth a read - have a look at the index entry for 'MILITARY MIND': "MILITARY MIND narrowness of, 1823 stubbornness of, not peculiar to America, 1826 does not seem to understand arithmetic, 1839 impossibility of trusting, 1867 regards thinking as a form of mutiny, 2041" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seaJane Posted 27 August , 2016 Share Posted 27 August , 2016 Random tangent: I've always thought that John Buchan was having a go at LlG with his portrait of Abinger Vennard in his short story 'A Lucid Interval'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle George Posted 28 August , 2016 Share Posted 28 August , 2016 10 hours ago, seaJane said: Random tangent: I've always thought that John Buchan was having a go at LlG with his portrait of Abinger Vennard in his short story 'A Lucid Interval'. John Buchan: "Of all the civilians I have known, Lloyd George seems to have possessed in the highest degree the capacity for becoming a great soldier. But he might have lost several armies while he was learning his trade." Quote from Thomas Jones' 'Lloyd George' (1951). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seaJane Posted 28 August , 2016 Share Posted 28 August , 2016 Hah. Good one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghazala Posted 29 August , 2016 Share Posted 29 August , 2016 On 27 August 2016 at 21:35, Uncle George said: He is not TEL. Bummer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle George Posted 24 October , 2016 Share Posted 24 October , 2016 Finding myself at something of a loose end, a victim of ennui and of a weary sense of disengagement, I wonder if anyone has the energy or appetite to divine the identity of this young officer: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neverforget Posted 24 October , 2016 Share Posted 24 October , 2016 I have both, and share your feelings, but have no idea on this one, though I suspect that there are a hat full of clues in your post. Well done for biting the bullet and resurrecting the sleeping giant. (Hopefully) I'm off to ponder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seaJane Posted 24 October , 2016 Share Posted 24 October , 2016 Given the ennui etc, could it be Saki? (wild guess!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle George Posted 24 October , 2016 Share Posted 24 October , 2016 30 minutes ago, neverforget said: I have both, and share your feelings, but have no idea on this one, though I suspect that there are a hat full of clues in your post. Well done for biting the bullet and resurrecting the sleeping giant. (Hopefully) I'm off to ponder. 27 minutes ago, seaJane said: Given the ennui etc, could it be Saki? (wild guess!) The 'ennui' was less a clue than a self-diagnosis. The clue was 'divine'. Not much of a clue really, but there it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragon Posted 24 October , 2016 Share Posted 24 October , 2016 (edited) Raymond Lodge, Oliver's son, because of his father's interest in spiritualism. After Raymond was killed Oliver tried to contact him. Oliver was famous partly for his for work on radio waves and on lightning which also connects with divining. Edited 24 October , 2016 by Dragon Clarity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gareth Davies Posted 24 October , 2016 Share Posted 24 October , 2016 This whole thread is about divining! Or do you mean the other meaning? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle George Posted 24 October , 2016 Share Posted 24 October , 2016 1 minute ago, Dragon said: Raymond Lodge, Oliver's son, because of his father's interest in spiritualism. Oliver tried to contact Raymond after he was killed. Oliver was famous partly for his for work on lightning which also connects with divining. Yes indeed. "Lodge wrote a book based on his communication with his son, Raymond, who was killed at Ypres in 1915. In it he described ‘Summerland’ where Raymond now resided, enjoying a life without the cares those on earth experienced." http://ww1centenary.oucs.ox.ac.uk/body-and-mind/a-solace-to-a-tortured-world-the-growing-interest-in-spiritualism-during-and-after-ww1/ I sometimes wonder how on earth those societies managed to cope with losses on that scale. Well, perhaps they did not. Germany in the 20s and 30s - a national mental breakdown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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