Guest Posted 27 March , 2017 Share Posted 27 March , 2017 12 minutes ago, Stoppage Drill said: During his tenure of office as War Minister he was generally known as 'Colonel' Seely. And the barb of a Churchill put down ( in the manner of Ernie Bevin and Herbert Morrison)- Someone said to Churchill-"So-and-so is the stupidest man alive". Churchill replied "Not while Jack Seely lives" I think the quote was from the Thirties or even the early years of WW2-but come on SD, who was Churchill talking to and who was second only in stupidity to JEB???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle George Posted 27 March , 2017 Share Posted 27 March , 2017 (edited) . Edited 27 March , 2017 by Uncle George blunder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fattyowls Posted 27 March , 2017 Share Posted 27 March , 2017 2 hours ago, Uncle George said: Yes, and aren't they splendid! Rather. What a cracking source; thanks for putting them up UG. Pete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle George Posted 27 March , 2017 Share Posted 27 March , 2017 2 hours ago, neverforget said: I would never have got Seeley, who was better known as Jack or a General, and rarely described as a Colonel (which was an honorary rank) Anyway, one assumes that Kipling is posted as another example as his name is visible. To continue with our Uncle's theme; another pair: I'm sure I've seen this picture very recently - possibly on this thread! But can I remember the names? (No). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neverforget Posted 27 March , 2017 Share Posted 27 March , 2017 Just now, Uncle George said: I'm sure I've seen this picture very recently - possibly on this thread! But can I remember the names? (No). Not only does it continue your theme, it also follows on from my last chap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fattyowls Posted 27 March , 2017 Share Posted 27 March , 2017 1 minute ago, Uncle George said: I'm sure I've seen this picture very recently - possibly on this thread! But can I remember the names? (No). I think the encumbered architect on the left is Edwin Lutyens; but I too know the face of the chap on the right, but can't think of his name. I spotted the theme for a change NF, good one. Pete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle George Posted 27 March , 2017 Share Posted 27 March , 2017 (edited) Sir Herbert Baker. I saw the picture in 'Empires of the Dead'. Edited 27 March , 2017 by Uncle George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neverforget Posted 27 March , 2017 Share Posted 27 March , 2017 3 minutes ago, Fattyowls said: I think the encumbered architect on the left is Edwin Lutyens; but I too know the face of the chap on the right, but can't think of his name. I spotted the theme for a change NF, good one. Pete. Lutyens is correct Pete. Ware brought them together despite them having fallen out on a previous project in India. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fattyowls Posted 27 March , 2017 Share Posted 27 March , 2017 If I remember correctly 'fell out' is a very mild description of what happened over New Delhi. Pete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neverforget Posted 27 March , 2017 Share Posted 27 March , 2017 1 minute ago, Uncle George said: Sir Herbert Baker. Is correct! Responsible for Tyne Cot. Incidentally, my posts were from the most recently read book called "Empires of the Dead" by David Crane. A marvellous piece of work imho. 1 minute ago, Fattyowls said: If I remember correctly 'fell out' is a very mild description of what happened over New Delhi. Pete. Quite so. They brought their differences with them to France, but still an inspired move by Ware. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fattyowls Posted 27 March , 2017 Share Posted 27 March , 2017 ...and which makes the cartoon so good I think. I've read David Crane's book and I thought it was good too. Pete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoppage Drill Posted 27 March , 2017 Author Share Posted 27 March , 2017 (edited) 3 hours ago, voltaire60 said: And the barb of a Churchill put down ( in the manner of Ernie Bevin and Herbert Morrison)- Someone said to Churchill-"So-and-so is the stupidest man alive". Churchill replied "Not while Jack Seely lives" I think the quote was from the Thirties or even the early years of WW2-but come on SD, who was Churchill talking to and who was second only in stupidity to JEB???? Dunno. A large field to choose from ! Had it been later than your timeframe I would have had a go at Asquith being (unfairly) the butt of the gibe. Remember, though, that "Churchill spent the best years of his life preparing impromptu remarks." Now who said that? " An empty taxi drew up at Downing Street, and Clement Attlee got out" Edited 27 March , 2017 by Stoppage Drill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle George Posted 27 March , 2017 Share Posted 27 March , 2017 21 minutes ago, Stoppage Drill said: " An empty taxi drew up at Downing Street, and Clement Attlee got out" WSC, when this was said in front of him: ''Mr. Attlee is an honourable and gallant gentleman, and a faithful colleague who served his country well at the time of her greatest need. I should be obliged if you would make it clear whenever an occasion arises that I would never make such a remark about him, and that I strongly disapprove of anybody who does.'' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 27 March , 2017 Share Posted 27 March , 2017 33 minutes ago, Stoppage Drill said: Dunno. A large field to choose from ! Had it been later than your timeframe I would have had a go at Asquith being (unfairly) the butt of the gibe. Remember, though, that "Churchill spent the best years of his life preparing impromptu remarks." Now who said that? " An empty taxi drew up at Downing Street, and Clement Attlee got out" SD-You disappoint!! I don't think it was Asquith - he and Churchill's joint interest in promoting UK wine and spirit consumption mitigates against that (Anthony Sampson's story about the rollicking drunks in Piccadilly before 1914 is a good one on the sobriety of WSC and "Squiffy"-as well as F.E.Smith-well worth searching out) You draw attention to Clement Richard A.- both Churchill and Attlee were local to where I live. Attlee lived in the Monkhams area of Woodford-indeed(although I have never worked it out one way or the other), it is possible that CRA had Churchill as his local MP for a time. I wonder who he voted for!! Despite Churchill's barbs, I plead in his defence. Yes, Churchill could be barbative- but he could also take the barbs as well. And both Jack Seely and Attlee held Churchill in high regard-and he them. Attlee, of course, being an approver of Churchill's Dardanelles schemes. By far the best quote about Churchill's greatness I have come across is by the imperial historian, the late A.P.Thornton: "Churchill, easy to criticise, impossible to diminish" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle George Posted 27 March , 2017 Share Posted 27 March , 2017 4 hours ago, voltaire60 said: And the barb of a Churchill put down ( in the manner of Ernie Bevin and Herbert Morrison)- Someone said to Churchill-"So-and-so is the stupidest man alive". Churchill replied "Not while Jack Seely lives" I think the quote was from the Thirties or even the early years of WW2-but come on SD, who was Churchill talking to and who was second only in stupidity to JEB???? I'm surprised to hear this- Seely and WSC were close friends, although they briefly fell out in 1919 when Seely resigned from the Air Ministry. my guess: WSC was talking to his great confidante Violet Bonham Carter; the stupid man was Stafford Cripps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 27 March , 2017 Share Posted 27 March , 2017 (edited) 2 hours ago, Uncle George said: my guess: WSC was talking to his great confidante Violet Bonham Carter; the stupid man was Stafford Cripps. I will have to track this down-I think it is somewhere in the Martin Gilbert official biography. Yes, WSC could be acerbic when in the company of dear Violet- but, not,I think, about Stafford Cripps. Churchill was well aware of his formidable intellectual skills- and,I think, rated him the greatest Labour threat before the war-as well as sending him to Moscow as Ambassador (OK,being Ambassador can be a way of getting rid of someone-but the Moscow job required brains, as well as the Cripps family connections with Russia pre-revolution) Something deep down in me half-remembers that the subject of the Churchill barb might be Leslie Hore-Belisha-and that someone had commented on L H-B being the stupidest Sec.State for War ever-hence, "Not while Jack Seely lives" (I think JEB pegged off in 1947) Edited 27 March , 2017 by Guest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle George Posted 27 March , 2017 Share Posted 27 March , 2017 22 minutes ago, voltaire60 said: I will have to track this down-I think it is somewhere in the Martin Gilbert official biography. Yes, WSC could be acerbic when in the company of dear Violet- but, not,I think, about Stafford Cripps. Churchill was well aware of his formidable intellectual skills- and,I think, rated him the greatest Labour threat before the war-as well as sending him to Moscow as Ambassador (OK,being Ambassador can be a way of getting rid of someone-but the Moscow job required brains, as well as the Cripps family connections with Russia pre-revolution) It is of course possible to possess intellectual gifts, and to be at the same time, stupid! I have Gilbert's one-volume 1991 biography: the anecdote is not to be found there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seaJane Posted 27 March , 2017 Share Posted 27 March , 2017 Can't find it in Google Books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle George Posted 27 March , 2017 Share Posted 27 March , 2017 The anecdote is not in John Charmley's 1993 biography; nor in Roy Jenkins' 2001 biography; nor Violet Bonham Carter's 1965 biographical sketch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neverforget Posted 27 March , 2017 Share Posted 27 March , 2017 Whilst the debate continues, who are these brothers in war, but not brothers in arms??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Ridgus Posted 27 March , 2017 Share Posted 27 March , 2017 17 hours ago, Stoppage Drill said: Jack Seely. Minister of War 1912-1914, Colonel Hampshire Yeomanry at start of war. Commanded Canadian Cavalry by 1918. Galloper Jack. Owner of 'Warrior.' Thank you SD. As I have the book and saw the documentary I don't know why I didn't make the connection. Oh yes of course, I'm old! David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle George Posted 27 March , 2017 Share Posted 27 March , 2017 42 minutes ago, neverforget said: Whilst the debate continues, who are these brothers in war, but not brothers in arms??? Something tells me we've had these chaps - is the unusual cap badge the Friends' Ambulance Unit, or similar? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaySearching Posted 27 March , 2017 Share Posted 27 March , 2017 (edited) 47 minutes ago, neverforget said: Whilst the debate continues, who are these brothers in war, but not brothers in arms??? Here's your cryptic clue Edited 27 March , 2017 by RaySearching Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle George Posted 27 March , 2017 Share Posted 27 March , 2017 Laurence and Bertie Cadbury. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neverforget Posted 27 March , 2017 Share Posted 27 March , 2017 5 minutes ago, Uncle George said: Something tells me we've had these chaps - is the unusual cap badge the Friends' Ambulance Unit, or similar? Well spotted Uncle George, you undoubtedly recognise the founder of the same. Apologies for the re-run; I don't recall them appearing before. 4 minutes ago, Uncle George said: Laurence and Bertie Cadbury. Indeed. A couple of local lads. I live about a mile away from Cadbury's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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