Guest Russell.Gore@crawley.gov.uk Posted 7 November , 2004 Share Posted 7 November , 2004 Evening all, whilst trawling through my local junk shop i came across a set of 3 Post Cards showing various groups of men at a pre war camp in Appleby Moor in Yorkshire ?,the post cards were addressed to a Mrs Easton in Lewes,Sussex,out of curiosity i checked in SDGW and found that he was listed as KIA in Flanders,upon visiting the PRO i was able to view his medal card and it was inscribed as "Accidentally Killed",this was interesting to say the least.I found that my man was serving with the R.F.A. with the 29th Brigade Ammunition Column,and according to the War Diary while the Brigade was in the Plugstreet Sector,this accident took place, 5th of April 1915, 5 MEN KILLED IN THE WAGON LINES WHILE ATTEMPTING TO REMOVE THE FUZE FROM A GERMAN SHELL.who the culprit was we shall never know,it seems such a needless accident as surely the 5 men were used to dealing with Ammo,i suppose this brings home the old saying about finding Duds on the Battle field "leave well alone" The 5 Soldiers Killed in the Accident were: Dvr.W.G.Easton, 29 Bde Ammo Column. Dvr.A.E.Brown , 125 Field Battery,RFA. Dvr.H Cunningham ,125 Field Battery,RFA. Dvr.A.E.Weaver, 125 Field Battery,RFA. Gnr.W.j.Lloyd , 125 Field Battery,RFA. All 5 Men are Buried Side by side at Trois Abres Cemetery,Steenweerck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbie Posted 7 November , 2004 Share Posted 7 November , 2004 Exactly, leave them alone. Interesting results mate. BTW: They're not Daily Mail postcards, are they? I had to ask..sorry Robbie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Russell.Gore@crawley.gov.uk Posted 7 November , 2004 Share Posted 7 November , 2004 NO the Cards were actually taken by a local photographer,i think i may have managed to I.D. Easton,as the same bloke is in all 3 pictures,i wonder what the MOD told his parents ?????...just changing tack for a minute,my contact has just informed me that 3 more Black Watch lads are en route to Germany in a very bad way...pray that they recover. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbie Posted 7 November , 2004 Share Posted 7 November , 2004 Indeed. Robbie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Russell.Gore@crawley.gov.uk Posted 7 November , 2004 Share Posted 7 November , 2004 remember being outside Tyne Cot,in 1991,there was a Dud 9.2 shell placed on the verge for recovery by BD,when a car pulls up out gets this bod,opens the boot of his car puts the shell in the back and off he went !!!,i think he was of Dutch origins.i always wonder what that shell is doing now ?. Doorstop,umberella stand,?????????. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redbarchetta Posted 7 November , 2004 Share Posted 7 November , 2004 I have a confession... Went on a tour about four years ago, when I was young and naive. Found an shrapnel shell casing at Lochnagar crater, full to the brim with mud, ah, ideal souvenir... Back at the hotel, I'll just clear out all the mud, and the empty cast iron case will be perfect reminder of the trip... Started chipping out the dried mud and thump, a shrapnel ball appears, then another - ah, it has still got the shrapnel balls inside, even better... Following day, going to Hill 60, and there, in the cafe, it a cross section of a shrapnel shell, confirming the explosive at the bottom, underneath the shrapnel (well, obviously, in hind sight !!). ******. Couldn't just leave it in the hotel room, could I ?? So, I brought it back and it is in the lounge - I guess if it has survived 90 years... Yes, yes, I KNOW NOW !!! But what else could I do at the time ? Figured when society breaks down and we are in a Mad Max world, it could come in handy... :S Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbie Posted 7 November , 2004 Share Posted 7 November , 2004 I hope you live on your own, Jim. I guess you must do - who would want to share a lounge room with that? Robbie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Dixon Posted 7 November , 2004 Share Posted 7 November , 2004 Found this little beauty lying in a field next to Caterpillar Valley cemetery, too bl**dy scared or sensible to touch it. Scary how much gets turned up still.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garyem1 Posted 7 November , 2004 Share Posted 7 November , 2004 Found these two in my back garden in Dover Kent, couple of weeks ago, I called the police, they called out the bomb squad who took them away. gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garyem1 Posted 7 November , 2004 Share Posted 7 November , 2004 Had to resize pic gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Poilu Posted 7 November , 2004 Share Posted 7 November , 2004 Jim, Usual advice must apply - do leave these items well alone. The Shrapnel shell you have is not inherently that dangerous, there is a small black powder charge in the base (not HE) but no detonator - it was ignited by a flash from the fuse. However, it is of course illegal to bring through customs and illegal to own here or in France. Since 9/11 in particular to have anything even remotely explosive in your possession is not a good idea...I speak from experience... There have been many interesting threads in the past discussing the subject of the aftermath of the Great War with regard to relics and munitions. Russell's original post is very interesting - I wonder just how many thousands of soldiers were killed by accidents and non-combatant means? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sapper6 Posted 8 November , 2004 Share Posted 8 November , 2004 Regarding UXB's or other ordnance. I have a background in Bomb Disposal.It is not the shell, unless HE or gas, that is dangerous, it is the charge used to propel it.This can become very unstable and people have lost eyes and fingers just from old bullets they thought were safe to pick up. I remember reading an article about 10 years ago of how a French farmer cut down an old tree that was one of the few left standing from WW1 in his area. He sat on the stump to have lunch and hours later was in hospital with very severe burns and blistering to his ****. The reason. The sap of the tree had still kept residule mustard gas and he paid the price. Just because its old does not mean it cannot hurt you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redbarchetta Posted 8 November , 2004 Share Posted 8 November , 2004 Giles, Thanks for your fatherly words, I did feel pretty stupid at the time for having picked it up, but I agree with you, I think now it is in a dry, relatively stable atmosphere, the chances of it spontaneously going off, especially unprimed and with no fuse cap, are minimal, so I'll just keep it as a reminder of what NOT to pick up in future !! Sapper's tale of the tree is incredible - I know mustard gas lingers, but didn't realise it could linger for ninety years !!! Will the farmer qualify for a war disability pension now ?... Or at least a SWB...!! Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Poilu Posted 8 November , 2004 Share Posted 8 November , 2004 You're making me feel old! If most of the balls have been ejected it may well have detonated but not completely or in the designed manner. The black powder charge is not dangerous in the same way as a HE charge becomes unstable. There is more black powder in the average large firework these days But...as always, one should never touch these things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BMoorhouse Posted 9 November , 2004 Share Posted 9 November , 2004 Since January 2004 in the UK there have been minimum sentencing provisions whereby a person who has possession (amongst other things) of "any...ammunition which consists in or incorporates a missile designed to explode on or immediately before impact and is for military use." (Section 5(1A)© Firearms Act 1968) faces a MANDATORY 5 YEARS IMPRISONMENT. I am no expert on weapon definitions but I would be very careful about keeping anything that could come within these definitions. Brendon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Russell.Gore@crawley.gov.uk Posted 9 November , 2004 Share Posted 9 November , 2004 In his Book Aftermath,Donovan webster spent many weeks observing the opereations carried out by the French Des Mineurs (Bomb Disposal),these guys are handling Munitions daily,and they estimate that there are over 12 million bits of ordanance all over the old 1st and 2nd war Battlefields,if you can get a copy of this book it is an excellent read...just thought i would put in a mention that my Gt.Uncle jack is buried in Caterpillar valley Military Cemetery,i have spent a lot of time in and around Longueval and have come across lots of Duds,in the words of the Chief Des Mineur..A shell may look worn and old on the outside but inside it is as new as the Day that it was made...just remember that in Future if you are ever tempted to fool around with this stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Poilu Posted 9 November , 2004 Share Posted 9 November , 2004 The book is indeed superb, if anyone is interested type 'Aftermath' in the search. There is also a superb documentary based on the book that really brings it to life including much footage of the demineurs in action. Over 400 of them have been kiled in the last 50 years performing this work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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