Gerries or Jerries? Bosch or Boche?

[catfishmo]

Which spelling was more commonly in use during WW1--Gerry or Jerry?

Any difference in Bosch and Boche?

Thanks!

~Ginger

[David Filsell]

All of the above.

[Magnumbellum]

Boche was the French slang for the Germans; Bosch would be a way of spelling it in German, but I am not aware of anyone actually so spelling it, and I cannot imagine why any Brit would want to do so.

[trenchtrotter]

Was Jerries used in the Great War? I don't recall seeing it in memoirs etc? I maybe wrong though but is it not more WW2?

TT

[SiegeGunner]

Bosche and Bosches occur quite frequently in British sources, usually personal diaries and memoirs. The French term is normally in the plural 'les Boches'. I have even seen 'die Boschen' in a German report on the interrogation of a French prisoner.

[Frank_East]

Boche was used by the French in both World Wars....boche ....the mouth as in the French Department Boche du Rhone which covers the territory at the mouth of the Rhone.****** incorrect...the mouth is bouche so Department 13 is the Bouche du Rhone not the Boche du Rhone.

The Great War Central Registry of British Intelligence in which Sir Claude Dansey featured, used an index denoting the degree of "Bocheness".

For instance Anglo Boche,Boche Anglo,Boche and the worse Boche,the Bad Boche

I seem to recall that pre Second World War,the term Jerry was used to denigrate German products as "Jerry built"

Just noted a further reference to Jerry.Of course there was the German petrol can which was referred to as a "Jerry Can".....then there was "the Jerry"

[headgardener]

I have seen 'Jerry' or 'Jerries' in Great War usage. More commonly 'Fritz', or 'the hun' (though probably used more by the officer class, or in a very derogatory way during the earlier days of the war), or 'the Boche' (can't remember seeing 'Boches' so much).

[paulgranger]

The Boche, or the Hun, were the only epithets in the war, so far as I know. The Americans may have introduced Kraut late in the war, but Jerry/Gerry is WW2 usage, although early on, the British were still using Boche.My Dad used to call the Germans 'Teds', having served in Italy.

[CROONAERT]

The Americans may have introduced Kraut late in the war,

and 'Heinie' - which I believe may have been in Canadian usage also.

Dave.

[Andrew Upton]

The Boche, or the Hun, were the only epithets in the war, so far as I know. The Americans may have introduced Kraut late in the war, but Jerry/Gerry is WW2 usage, although early on...

Jerry is perfectly correct for WW1, as has been said several times above - earliest I have seen is newspaper reports from 1916 (which felt the need to explain the term since it was so new).

[paulgranger]

Andrew, I stand corrected.

[IRC Kevin]

Seen 'Fritz' a fair few times in the sources.

[JWK]

The German soldiers (or at the very least Fritz Limbach) called the English : Tommy.

And the English soldiers called the Germans Fritz .

See this little cross-trench conversation Fritz Limbach had back in September 1915 with a Tommy:

(From http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=216051&page=3 )

For the rest not much news. Tommy still behaves well, because mother likes to hear that.

By the way they now answer when you call them. We call “Tommy” and they reply “Fritz”, but also Saupreusse [ “Prussian b*****s”] etc.

There are a few amongst them who speak very good German.

Last night the following conversation:

-Tommy!

-Hallo Fritz, haben Sie gut geschlafen? [Did you sleep well?] (Very gentleman-like of them to address us as “Sie” [= you, formal] , where we barbarians just address them with “Du” [= you, familiar] without even thinking about it)

-Thank you Tommy, very good. You speak excellent German, where did you learn that?

-I’ve learned it in Germany

-Where have you been in Germany?

-Cologne, Berlin and Oberammergau in Bavaria

-Well Tommy, come here, then we’ll go to Cologne together for a glass of beer.

-Yes, but if I do you’ll shoot ! The beer is excellent in Germany btw.

This "Tommy" business only came about sort of halfway through 1915: in the first half year Fritz called them English "the English",

it's only in July/August 1915 that he starts calling them "Tommy"

JW

[brianmorris547]

In the Bolton papers I've only noticed that Officers refer to them as Bosches or Huns and the ORs simply refer to them in letters home as the Germans. I'm going through the papers again 100 years on and today I noticed in the Bolton Evening News 19/03/1915 a letter to a man in Bolton from 4019 L/Cpl J Simmons 1 Bn Black Watch in which he wrote "The Gerryman's sniper is a crack shot".

Brian

[SiegeGunner]

"The Gerryman's sniper is a crack shot".

That's a blend of 'Gerry' and 'the Alleyman' (from French 'Allemand').

[Dai Bach y Sowldiwr]

Another vote for "Bosche":

This from the war diary of 593 MT Coy., ASC

(PS. How unsporting of them! - Cotton Wool???)

[arboskittler]

Maybe 'Fritz' was more popular?

Some extracts from my Great Uncles diary (a Gloucestershire man serving with the Worcesters)

Monday 21 May 1917 - On water carrying party. Strafed at night by the Boche

Sunday 10 June 1917 - Strafed by Fritz at stand down. 3 killed 4 wounded in our trench.........

Saturday 16 June 1917 - Strafed by Fritz in evening..........

Friday July 6 1917 - Went over top at 9.30pm. Fritz too strong for us got cut off from remainder of Coy and took refuge in a shell hole.........

Cheers,

Andy.

[Uncle George]

Interesting etymology for 'Boche' here:

http://www.billcasselman.com/wording_room/boche.htm

It means 'obstinate', it seems.

[angelab]

I have heard that the French delighted in referring to the Germans as "les Al-boches", which - if you make the liaison between the s and the a - can come out as "les sales boches" (dirty Germans). Or maybe this was more WW2 than WW1.

[bill24chev]

That's a blend of 'Gerry' and 'the Alleyman' (from French 'Allemand').

A popular song of the time included a line something like "where the Alleyman cant get me"

[new3.2]

Just to add a little fat to the fire, my great-uncle, Billy Fennell, served in Co. A, 108th Engineers, 33rd Div. [uS] used the word Hoch, and sometimes Jerry as his name for the German soldier in his diary. "Sept 26, 1918 [building a road] Strabel and I worked together and found ourselves playing with a Hock skeleton. Found a pair of Hock boots with the feet in them".

Ken

[catfishmo]

"Sept 26, 1918 [building a road] Strabel and I worked together and found ourselves playing with a Hock skeleton. Found a pair of Hock boots with the feet in them".

Ken

I find this little snippet revealing. "Playing" with a skeleton? Boots with feet still inside? If I had come across a pair of boots with feet still in them, the diary would include more than a passing phrase with a period at the end! I think it illustrates how blase' they became to seeing dead bodies. In one of my favorite accounts, Sapper Martin, he makes some ho-hum observation of death then goes on for at least a paragraph at the crisis of running out of pipe tobacco!

[Guest]

The diary of the 1/6th Seaforth Highlanders July 1918 mention the Bosche a number of times.

1/7/1918 Our aircraft was very active and frequently fired on by Bosche AA.

2/7/1918 The Bosche attempted a small raid on our left

Mike

[Guest]

Any chance it was derived from Bosch " founded by Robert Bosch in Stuttgart in 1886 "

Mike

[Magnumbellum]

Although the name of the firm Bosch is well-known today, I doubt whether it was particularly prominent a century ago.

It seems to me more likely that the Germanic spelling of what is indubitably a French slang word arose from writing it as heard without realising that it was actually French, and making a false assumption that it was a German word.

Over time, such a spelling, based on misunderstanding, would just be accepted as a variant spelling.

,