pol o frithil Posted 16 November , 2004 Share Posted 16 November , 2004 When men enlisted in the army.royal flying corps and the navy . was there a photograph taken of them to be put with there enlistment papers . if so it would be a great way of seeing what they looked like. on the top of the forum page it lists a man who was killed on a specific day for each day of the war . just wondering who decides on what man gets mentioned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desmond7 Posted 16 November , 2004 Share Posted 16 November , 2004 A very good question -even if it does have the potential to open up a can of worms! And I do not mean that as a put-down. It is a valid question to ask when the interest in soldiers of Catholic/Nationalist extraction is reaching unprecedented levels. That can only be a good thing for history. Since the 'nation' then was known as Great Britain AND Ireland as opposed to the present-day GB and NI ... this is worth examining. I do not think anything will be changed:- 1. Because it would be a MASSIVE task. 2. It would have political repercussions - oh yeah!! If anything was to be changed, I think CWGC might consider listing those soldiers who presently fall under 'UK' at present as 'British Army' casualties. I.E. they were members of regiments which fell under the structure of the British Army. Given the number of Irishmen in 'English/Scots Welsh' regts. AND the English/Scots and Welsh In Irish Regiments, the task would be well nigh impossible. A minefield .. but a good debate! Des Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_Hartley Posted 16 November , 2004 Share Posted 16 November , 2004 I think CWGC might consider listing those soldiers who presently fall under 'UK' at present as 'British Army' casualties. I.E. they were members of regiments which fell under the structure of the British Army. I think this is actually the exisitng basis for determining nationality on the CWGC record. So, for instance, Brits who were working in Canada and joined Canadian units, are recorded as being Canadian. I havn't voted because I'm not sure what's meant by "no decision". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desmond7 Posted 16 November , 2004 Share Posted 16 November , 2004 A-ha - Uncle Harters .... but if I read Pol right, he's speaking in modern day terms of understanding. And, whilst descendants might well admit that their ancestors were 'at the end of the day' IN the British ARMY ... they are hardly likely to see them as anything other than Irish .. and most certainly not as UK citizens. Des Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_Hartley Posted 17 November , 2004 Share Posted 17 November , 2004 Des I do understand the question Pol is posing (with the exception as above). My response was to your point where I was confirming (to the best of my knowledge) that the change you sought, was actually the current position. CWGC records the nationality of the fighting unit, not the fighting man. If I've misunderstood your point, then my apologies. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desmond7 Posted 19 November , 2004 Share Posted 19 November , 2004 HI John - just back from a trip. I think we are both on the same wavelength. I'm just throwing in the idea that 'UK' casualties COULD be 're-named' as a category as 'British Army casualties' - of course it amounts to one and the same thing. As such it would be a cosmetic exercise. It would be a wonderful research tool if there was a breakdown into England/Scotland/Wales/Ireland categories. However, as I said before, it would require major work on a huge database. Des Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
christine liava'a Posted 19 November , 2004 Share Posted 19 November , 2004 and don't forget the "colonial" and other nationalities in the BEF- 1000s of them! I think the best thing to do if you are going to change things, is to make sure that the original home address or nok address is obvious, which will tell a researcher where that person comes from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobB Posted 19 November , 2004 Share Posted 19 November , 2004 Christine, Yes and what about all the British born seving in the Australian New Zealand and Canadian Armies . To single out an individuals place of birth would be helpful for family historians but an impossible task for the GWCC.Leave alone RobB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warren Posted 20 November , 2004 Share Posted 20 November , 2004 Hi, On the matter of re-labelling Irish casualties, as a Dubliner I would say that while sometimes it feels a bit odd selecting 'nationality = UK' when researching Irish casualties, I have voted in favour of leaving it as is because: (1) UK citizenship is historically accurate at the time of their death. (2) It reflects a logical category for the force that they joined (Australian if joined AIF, UK if joined British Army, etc) (3) It might not reflect the outlook of many Ulster Unionist and Irish Unionist casualties of the war. So leave as is I'd say. Whats there provides a logical way to search (but bring back the regimental search on CWGC - whatever happened to that?!) Cheers, Warren Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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