Can anybody understand what these ships were

[Simon Tindall]

Looking for details on my other great grandfather Percy Stockley M836

all I've found is the below  but not much else what is of an interest is what ships are listed and where served   thanks guys

[RNCVR]

Well first off his rate was Plumber's Mate, then Plumber, which he passed for on 16 Oct 1911. He was subsequently rated Plumber 1st class on 1 Oct 1918, this being equivalent to a Petty Officer 1st class rate.

 

His wartime service was on HMS Endeavour which was a Survey ship of March 1912.he served on her 3x, the longest being 15 Apl 1914 to 29 Apl 1917.  He finished up the war on HMS Gibraltar , which was a 1st class Cruiser of Apl 1892, but which subsequently became a a Depot Ship in 1914.

 

He was in & out of HMS Pembroke several times as this was his Home Port Depot Ship based at Chatham.

 

Hope this assists you somewhat.

 

Best....Bryan

[Simon Tindall]

2 minutes ago, RNCVR said:

Well first off his rate was Plumber's Mate, then Plumber, which he passed for on 16 Oct 1911. He was subsequently rated Plumber 1st class on 1 Oct 1918, this being equivalent to a Petty Officer 1st class rate.

 

His wartime service was on HMS Endeavour which was a Survey ship of March 1912.he served on her 3x, the longest being 15 Apl 1914 to 29 Apl 1917.  He finished up the war on HMS Gibraltar , which was a 1st class Cruiser of Apl 1892, but which subsequently became a a Depot Ship in 1914.

 

He was in & out of HMS Pembroke several times as this was his Home Port Depot Ship based at Chatham.

 

Hope this assists you somewhat.

 

Best....Bryan

Thanks Bryan That's a great help was there any other ships he served on?  and what areas of the world would these ships  have been deployed? thanks again

[RNCVR]

Stockley's two early in his career ships he served on were both Battleships(pre Dreadnought Battleships) - HMS Albemarle(1901) & HMS Lord Nelson(1906).

 

To know where these ships were at the time he served on them I would have to check my Navy Lists, but unable to do at this time,

will try later in evg or tomorrow unless some other mate comes along to assist you.

 

Endeavour was employed on Surveying Service in the July 1914 NL but does not give a specific location.  She recommissioned on 15 Apl '14 at Chatham when Stockley joined her for the 2nd time. You might try Google for a location.

 

I will tell you about his GCB's (Badges column) next time as supper calls now (I am in Canada).

 

Best...Bryan

 

 

 

 

[Simon Tindall]

6 minutes ago, RNCVR said:

Stockley's two early in his career ships he served on were both Battleships(pre Dreadnought Battleships) - HMS Albemarle(1901) & HMS Lord Nelson(1906).

 

To know where these ships were at the time he served on them I would have to check my Navy Lists, but unable to do at this time,

will try later in evg or tomorrow unless some other mate comes along to assist you.

 

Endeavour was employed on Surveying Service in the July 1914 NL but does not give a specific location.  She recommissioned on 15 Apl '14 at Chatham when Stockley joined her for the 2nd time. You might try Google for a location.

 

I will tell you about his GCB's (Badges column) next time as supper calls now (I am in Canada).

 

Best...Bryan

 

 

 

 

Thanks Bryan

Really appreciate this its amazing enjoy your supper and best wishes I look forward to more detail when you can thank you

[rolt968]

Is HMS Egmont (II?) Malta?

RM

[seaJane]

16 minutes ago, rolt968 said:

Is HMS Egmont (II?) Malta?

RM

 

I believe so, depot ship / accounting base after 1916.

May be worth searching for the others on http://www.naval-history.net/

[RNCVR]

Yes, HMS Egmont is Base Ship Malta, from March 1904.  Egmont II was accounting base for ships based at Port Said.

 

HMS Albemarle (B\S) was Atlantic Fleet 1907-12.

 

HMS Lord Nelson (her guns & mountings were assigned to newly building HMS Dreadnought to speed up her completion) was Flagship at Nore then Channel Fleet.

 

HMS Tenados was part of Base Pembroke training establishment.

 

I think we have all of his ships & bases now Simon.

 

Best...Bryan

[RNCVR]

Simon, now Stockley's  GCB's (Good Conduct Badges) --- 

RN Ratings were granted up to 3 GCB's during thir career. They were paid a per diem rate for each of these badges so it behooved them to try to keep a clean conduct record & receive their GC badges when they came due at

3, 8 & 13 yr intervals.  If they remained clean for 15 yrs then they qualified for the RN Long Service medal with a gratuity as well.

Stockley did not receive the LS medal as he did not have enough time in. 

But he would have rec'd 1WW medals, likely a 1914-15 star, War, & Victory medals.

 

Stockley rec'd his first GCB on time - 18 Feb 1912, but then he lost it - ie: he was Deprived of it on 15 Jun 1912, for an unspecified infraction, & that could entail almost any infraction, but nothing major like hitting an officer or refusing duty or inciting mutiny. Normally they got their lost GCB restored 6 months later if they maintained a clean conduct record. & Stockley had his GCB restored on 14 Dec '12.

He was subsequently granted his 2nd GCB on 16 Feb 1917, due at that time.

 

The Remarks Column indicates his various 'Time In' pay raises.Normally they rec'd a pay raise after 3 yrs in rate. then 6 yrs, then 9 yrs.

Thats what those numbers in ( ) in the Rating column mean.

Thus when he was advanced to 1st class Plumber on 1 Oct '18, & completed 3 yrs in that rate he was granted a pay raise.

ie: (3)  in the Remarks column.

 

Lastly, he was Discharged to Shore on 28 March 1921, this was due to the post war reduction of the RN in the early '20's, many men lost their careers then but they were paid a War Service Gratuity to "ease the pain". so to speak. & you can see the WSG stamp in the Remarks column, in addition to his Unemployment Insurance Form stamp.

 

if you have any more questions I will try to answer to the best I am able Simon,

 

Best & Stay Safe!

Bryan

[RNCVR]

I missed the Clothing & Bedding column at bottom of his Record.....

This indicates he was paid 2 pounds 10 shillings for his initial C & B grant upon FE (First Entry) 18 Feb 1909. This is when his Adult time(age 18 & over) started counting for GC Badges, LS Medal, & Pension.

 

Basically what these ADM188 Ratings Records are are Pay Records - they record everything a rating was paid for or lost pay for.

The Ship's Writers ensured these records were kept up to date as a rating moved from ship to ship & base to base, or base to ship etc.

Each Rating carried his Parchment Record with him as he moved from draft to draft & turned it in when he presented himself onboard, & he was given that Record when he was Discharged at the end of his period of service.  The ADM 188 series is what was retained at Admiralty HQ's & also kept up to date.

 

Thanks!

Bryan

[Simon Tindall]

20 hours ago, RNCVR said:

Simon, now Stockley's  GCB's (Good Conduct Badges) --- 

RN Ratings were granted up to 3 GCB's during thir career. They were paid a per diem rate for each of these badges so it behooved them to try to keep a clean conduct record & receive their GC badges when they came due at

3, 8 & 13 yr intervals.  If they remained clean for 15 yrs then they qualified for the RN Long Service medal with a gratuity as well.

Stockley did not receive the LS medal as he did not have enough time in. 

But he would have rec'd 1WW medals, likely a 1914-15 star, War, & Victory medals.

 

Stockley rec'd his first GCB on time - 18 Feb 1912, but then he lost it - ie: he was Deprived of it on 15 Jun 1912, for an unspecified infraction, & that could entail almost any infraction, but nothing major like hitting an officer or refusing duty or inciting mutiny. Normally they got their lost GCB restored 6 months later if they maintained a clean conduct record. & Stockley had his GCB restored on 14 Dec '12.

He was subsequently granted his 2nd GCB on 16 Feb 1917, due at that time.

 

The Remarks Column indicates his various 'Time In' pay raises.Normally they rec'd a pay raise after 3 yrs in rate. then 6 yrs, then 9 yrs.

Thats what those numbers in ( ) in the Rating column mean.

Thus when he was advanced to 1st class Plumber on 1 Oct '18, & completed 3 yrs in that rate he was granted a pay raise.

ie: (3)  in the Remarks column.

 

Lastly, he was Discharged to Shore on 28 March 1921, this was due to the post war reduction of the RN in the early '20's, many men lost their careers then but they were paid a War Service Gratuity to "ease the pain". so to speak. & you can see the WSG stamp in the Remarks column, in addition to his Unemployment Insurance Form stamp.

 

if you have any more questions I will try to answer to the best I am able Simon,

 

Best & Stay Safe!

Bryan

Thanks Bryan So thankful for this really appreciate your time I unfortunately have no medals or items from his service so if I was at a military fair or the like I can look for insignia ect   is their anything specific that he would of had worn? re insignia badges etc

[Simon Tindall]

20 hours ago, RNCVR said:

Yes, HMS Egmont is Base Ship Malta, from March 1904.  Egmont II was accounting base for ships based at Port Said.

 

HMS Albemarle (B\S) was Atlantic Fleet 1907-12.

 

HMS Lord Nelson (her guns & mountings were assigned to newly building HMS Dreadnought to speed up her completion) was Flagship at Nore then Channel Fleet.

 

HMS Tenados was part of Base Pembroke training establishment.

 

I think we have all of his ships & bases now Simon.

 

Best...Bryan

great I will look these ships up   so he would of experienced some combat during the war?   ironically my other great granddad served in the RND started at deal I believe as RM engineer and was in the 63rd Signals  service number 853   then 207466 Joseph Tindall.     I Think may of been part of an initiative where he went from a work house he was raised in (Hanwell)

and possibly trained on the TS Exmouth moored in east London Essex around 1890s not sure haven't been able to trace him for sure but suspect as he joined the great war around the age of 36 he had previously served. Wish I could  go back in time and have a 10 minute chat with both my great grand parents as I am sure they had a few stories to tell between them and both survived the war    

[RNCVR]

Thanks Bryan

So thankful for this really appreciate your time I unfortunately have no medals or items from his service so if I was at a military fair or the like I can look for insignia ect   is their anything specific that he would of had worn? re insignia badges etc

 

Hi Simon,Yes I can give you photos of what Percy Stockley's insignia would have looked like during his period of service....

 

This would have been his PO rank badge & GCB. However he would have worn 2 GCB's, I only have a one GCB insignia to show you.

 

 

This would have been his Plumber rate badge, this insignia was worn by all other Artisans except Shipwrights who had a star above the crossed hammer & axe logo. 

 

Edited 1 May , 2020 by RNCVR
.

[RNCVR]

28 minutes ago, Simon Tindall said:

great I will look these ships up   so he would of experienced some combat during the war?    Wish I could  go back in time and have a 10 minute chat with both my great grand parents as I am sure they had a few stories to tell between them and both survived the war    

 

I have since discovered that HMS Endeavour was in the Mediterranean Sea during 1913 & 1914 on Survey duties.

I doubt he would have seen action whilst on board her, however if she had remained in the Med she may have been involved in some way with the Gallipoli campaign during 1915.  Endeavour was only equipped with a 3 pounder deck gun which would not a lot of use in a sea fight!

Its difficult to say but I doubt he saw much, if any, real action.  Perhaps he felt himself blessed, however we will never know tho.

 

Best....Bryan

 

Yes,I agree, it would be nice to be able to go back in time to speak to some of those veterans that experienced those times!

[Simon Tindall]

17 minutes ago, RNCVR said:

Thanks Bryan

So thankful for this really appreciate your time I unfortunately have no medals or items from his service so if I was at a military fair or the like I can look for insignia ect   is their anything specific that he would of had worn? re insignia badges etc

 

Hi Simon,Yes I can give you photos of what Percy Stockley's insignia would have looked like during his period of service....

 

This would have been his PO rank badge & GCB. However he would have worn 2 GCB's, I only have a one GCB insignia to show you.

 

 

This would have been his Plumber rate badge, this insignia was worn by all other Artisans except Shipwrights who had a star above the crossed hammer & axe logo. 

 

Thanks Bryan

[RNCVR]

Simon, I have written to a friend in Uk & asked him to check the RN 1WW medal roll to determine if Stockley was entitled to any 1WW campaign medals.

[Simon Tindall]

Thanks Bryan

[RNCVR]

Just rec'd a response Simon ---- Percy Stockley qualified for & received his British War & Victory medals for his 1WW service. 

 

They could be "out there" somewhere, perhaps in a collection, who knows?

 

 

Edited 1 May , 2020 by RNCVR
.

[Simon Tindall]

18 minutes ago, RNCVR said:

Just rec'd a response Simon ---- Percy Stockley qualified for & received his British War & Victory medals for his 1WW service. 

 

They could be "out there" somewhere, perhaps in a collection, who knows?

 

 

good stuff yes out there somewhere I have two sets of medals to locate now   fingers crossed  

[pete-c]

On ‎30‎/‎04‎/‎2020 at 21:58, Simon Tindall said:

Thanks Bryan That's a great help was there any other ships he served on?  and what areas of the world would these ships  have been deployed? thanks again

 

A great deal of surveying work was called for at an early stage of the Dardanelles operation.  It was therefore decided to send out a survey vessel (HMS Endeavour) as well as a printing plant capable of reproducing the surveys on the spot. 

The press and its staff were sent from England, in Endeavour, arriving at Kephalo Harbour, Imbros, on 26 October 1915.  A number of surveys were awaiting reproduction and these were at first reproduced on board Endeavour; later, when time permitted,the press was set up ashore.

Following the evacuation of the Gallipoli Peninsula, and the withdrawal of the Fleet from Kephalo, the Press was transferred to Mudros (on the island of Lemnos) on 13 May 1916.  HMS Endeavour left the station shortly afterwards.

In August 1917, the Press was combined with a printing section from the Survey of Egypt, and attached to the staff of the C-in C at Malta, being installed in an office in the Dockyard.

 

The above information is from The War Work of the Hydrographic Department 1914-1918.  Hope it's of some use Simon.

 

Edited 7 May , 2020 by pete-c

[MerchantOldSalt]

HMS Endeavour, despite looking like a yacht was actually purpose built in 1912 at The Fairfield Shipbuilding and Engineering Yard at Govan on the Clyde for the Admiralty's Survey Service. With a compliment of around 44 men she displaced 1280 tons, was 200 feet long and could manage 13 knots according to Janes. She lasted until 1946 but latterly as a Depot Ship.

 

Tony

 

[pete-c]

She was certainly a lovely looking vessel.  Thanks for posting Tony.

[Kath]

The 1911 census shows him on the Lord Nelson:

https://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?dbid=2352&h=32852892&indiv=try&o_vc=Record:OtherRecord&rhSource=60522

 

[RNCVR]

1 hour ago, pete-c said:

She was certainly a lovely looking vessel.  Thanks for posting Tony.

 

 

Agree, a Beautiful ship!  Nice to view her lines & not a deck gun in sight!

Thanks for posting that nice image of Endeavour Tony!

 

Best....Bryan

[Simon Tindall]

On 07/05/2020 at 06:58, pete-c said:

 

A great deal of surveying work was called for at an early stage of the Dardanelles operation.  It was therefore decided to send out a survey vessel (HMS Endeavour) as well as a printing plant capable of reproducing the surveys on the spot. 

The press and its staff were sent from England, in Endeavour, arriving at Kephalo Harbour, Imbros, on 26 October 1915.  A number of surveys were awaiting reproduction and these were at first reproduced on board Endeavour; later, when time permitted,the press was set up ashore.

Following the evacuation of the Gallipoli Peninsula, and the withdrawal of the Fleet from Kephalo, the Press was transferred to Mudros (on the island of Lemnos) on 13 May 1916.  HMS Endeavour left the station shortly afterwards.

In August 1917, the Press was combined with a printing section from the Survey of Egypt, and attached to the staff of the C-in C at Malta, being installed in an office in the Dockyard.

 

The above information is from The War Work of the Hydrographic Department 1914-1918.  Hope it's of some use Simon.

 

Thanks very much for the information