Mad Matron Posted 14 September , 2020 Share Posted 14 September , 2020 (edited) Can anyone identify this cap badge worn by my Great Uncle Cecil. I know he was definitely in WW1 but can't find him in any war records. I've tried matching the badge with others on Google but because the photo of the badge isn't sharp it's hard to tell! His brothers were in the Royal Warwickshire's, Gordon HIghlander's and Kings Royal Rifles! It looks like a circular badge with a scroll underneath. Edited 14 September , 2020 by Mad Matron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Garrett Posted 14 September , 2020 Share Posted 14 September , 2020 I can't see a photo! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headgardener Posted 14 September , 2020 Share Posted 14 September , 2020 If its a choice between those 3 regiments then it's most likely to be KRRC, but you'd need to attach a photo of you want a definitive diagnosis...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Matron Posted 14 September , 2020 Author Share Posted 14 September , 2020 Sorry I forgot to add the photo!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headgardener Posted 14 September , 2020 Share Posted 14 September , 2020 None of the above! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waddell Posted 14 September , 2020 Share Posted 14 September , 2020 That doesn't look like any of the three you mentioned. You might do better provide a few more details about great uncle Cecil. Scott Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headgardener Posted 14 September , 2020 Share Posted 14 September , 2020 Hard to tell, but it looks like RAMC with the crown hidden under the fold of the front of the cap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Matron Posted 14 September , 2020 Author Share Posted 14 September , 2020 1 minute ago, Waddell said: That doesn't look like any of the three you mentioned. You might do better provide a few more details about great uncle Cecil. Scott No, I know he wasn't in any of those!! 2 minutes ago, Waddell said: That doesn't look like any of the three you mentioned. You might do better provide a few more details about great uncle Cecil. Scott Just now, Mad Matron said: I know he was only 18 when he joined the war. His brother Albert was killed and his other brother Percy survived as did Cecil. His sister was in the ASC as driver. They lived in Warwickshire but this isn't a Warwickshire badge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waddell Posted 14 September , 2020 Share Posted 14 September , 2020 Like I said, you may get some more help with more details. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Hall Posted 14 September , 2020 Share Posted 14 September , 2020 (edited) The nearest cap badge in Swinnerton's book - looks to be the Essex Yeomanry, sans Crown, hidden by the crown of the cap. It's a puzzler. Wasn't from Chelmsford or Epping, by any chance? There is another query - Which looks very simjilar, and having seen this, RAMC looks possible too. Edited 14 September , 2020 by Gunner Hall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CorporalPunishment Posted 14 September , 2020 Share Posted 14 September , 2020 West Somerset Yeomanry. Pete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Hall Posted 14 September , 2020 Share Posted 14 September , 2020 1 minute ago, CorporalPunishment said: West Somerset Yeomanry. Pete. How did I miss that one, On target. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RNCVR Posted 14 September , 2020 Share Posted 14 September , 2020 (edited) I expect you will all think I am crazy but it sure bears some resemblance to the (Canadian) 1WW PPCLI Marguerite cap badge. Thanks, Bryan Edit - no, I am incorrect no crown above this soldier's badge......... Apologies! Edited 14 September , 2020 by RNCVR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jay dubaya Posted 14 September , 2020 Share Posted 14 September , 2020 Looks like we’ll have to wait for mad matron to come round again.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HERITAGE PLUS Posted 14 September , 2020 Share Posted 14 September , 2020 (edited) I thought West Somerset Yeomanry, but is badge in the photo too round? Edited 14 September , 2020 by HERITAGE PLUS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Matron Posted 14 September , 2020 Author Share Posted 14 September , 2020 1 hour ago, jay dubaya said: Looks like we’ll have to wait for mad matron to come round again.... Sorry I've been away from my computer! Uncle Cecils uncle enlisted in the Canadian Army Forestry Corps if that helps? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 14 September , 2020 Share Posted 14 September , 2020 (edited) I agree with Pete and can make out the Dragon of Somerset as central device of the associated Yeomanry cap badge. It does look a little rounder because of the angle of view, but it’s oval shape can still be discerned. Edited 14 September , 2020 by FROGSMILE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Matron Posted 14 September , 2020 Author Share Posted 14 September , 2020 5 minutes ago, FROGSMILE said: I agree with Pete and can make out the Dragon of Somerset as central device of the associated Yeomanry cap badge. It does look a little rounder because of the angle of view, but it’s oval shape can still be discerned. 5 minutes ago, FROGSMILE said: I agree with Pete and can make out the Dragon of Somerset as central device of the associated Yeomanry cap badge. It does look a little rounder because of the angle of view, but it’s oval shape can still be discerned. Thanks a lot for that. He had no connection with Somerset, was Warwickshire born and bred but I guess if his brother joined a Scottish regiment then why shouldn't he join a Somerset one?!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Atkins Posted 14 September , 2020 Share Posted 14 September , 2020 The Canadian Forestry Corps badge had a crown and no scroll, I think; in fairness I can accept there might be a crown in the photo which is obscured. West Somerset Yeomanry would fit what I can see of the gaps in the badge centre, and I agree that the shape might well appear more, or less, elliptical depending on angle. Another possible might be one of the OTCs (about which I know nothing, sorry). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 14 September , 2020 Share Posted 14 September , 2020 (edited) 39 minutes ago, Mad Matron said: Thanks a lot for that. He had no connection with Somerset, was Warwickshire born and bred but I guess if his brother joined a Scottish regiment then why shouldn't he join a Somerset one?!! All the Yeomanry regiments became associated with one or other of the several ‘cavalry reserve regiments’ that became responsible for feeding battle casualty replacements to France and Flanders and as part of that process nurtured recovered wounded until they were considered trained up and fit enough to rejoin their place in the line. If he was a Warwickshire man then it’s extremely likely there he served with some other unit previously and only joined the Somerset’s subsequently. As with all Territorial Force units the Yeomanry were truly local units and at the beginning of the war would have compromised men who lived near to the regiment’s drill stations. It would be unlikely then for him to have commenced his service in Somerset unless he had been living there pre-war. Edited 14 September , 2020 by FROGSMILE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Garrett Posted 14 September , 2020 Share Posted 14 September , 2020 49 minutes ago, FROGSMILE said: Dragon of Somerset As a Somerset boy (many years ago) I can authoritatively say it's not a dragon but a wyvern. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Matron Posted 14 September , 2020 Author Share Posted 14 September , 2020 5 minutes ago, Robin Garrett said: As a Somerset boy (many years ago) I can authoritatively say it's not a dragon but a wyvern. 11 minutes ago, FROGSMILE said: All the Yeomanry regiments became associated with one or other of the several ‘cavalry reserve regiments’ that became responsible for feeding battle casualty replacements to France and Flanders and as part of that process nurtured recovered wounded until they were considered trained up and fit enough to rejoin their place in the line. If he was a Warwickshire man then it’s extremely likely there he served with some other unit previously and only joined the Somerset’s subsequently. As with all Territorial Force units the Yeomanry were truly local units and at the beginning of the war would have compromised men who lived near to the regiment’s drill stations. It would be unlikely then for him to have commenced his service in Somerset unless he had been living there pre-war. That makes a lot of sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 14 September , 2020 Share Posted 14 September , 2020 (edited) 34 minutes ago, Robin Garrett said: As a Somerset boy (many years ago) I can authoritatively say it's not a dragon but a wyvern. That interests me greatly because in the 1890s the RWF was ordered to represent its “Red Dragon”, styled differently, heraldically from the “Dragon of Wales”, with a Griffin’s head (i.e. with a beak). In 1920, at the same time as the spelling was changed from WELSH to WELCH, the head was changed from a Griffin to a Dragon, but I’ve never been able to find a properly recorded rationale. The much later Wessex Brigade and subsequent Wessex Regiment had a Wyvern as it’s badge, but that had no back legs, and a twisted tail, unlike the beast at the centre of the Somerset Yeomanry badge, which is remarkably similar to the post-1920 RWF Red Dragon configuration. Edited 14 September , 2020 by FROGSMILE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Garrett Posted 14 September , 2020 Share Posted 14 September , 2020 23 minutes ago, FROGSMILE said: The much later Wessex Brigade and subsequent Wessex Regiment had a Wyvern as it’s badge, but that had no back legs, and a twisted tail, unlike the beast at the centre of the Somerset Yeomanry badge, which is remarkably similar to the post-1920 RWF Red Dragon configuration. Frogsmile I defer to you. The point I was trying to make was that a Somerset dragon was a wyvern. I didn't look at the badge itself to see whether it had back legs. A wyvern was also the badge of 43 Wessex Div in WW2 and went on as the badge of $3 Wessex Div / Dist. I lived close to where the Div / Dist HQ was in the 50s and saw it regularly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 14 September , 2020 Share Posted 14 September , 2020 9 minutes ago, Robin Garrett said: Frogsmile I defer to you. The point I was trying to make was that a Somerset dragon was a wyvern. I didn't look at the badge itself to see whether it had back legs. A wyvern was also the badge of 43 Wessex Div in WW2 and went on as the badge of $3 Wessex Div / Dist. I lived close to where the Div / Dist HQ was in the 50s and saw it regularly. I don’t doubt your assertion that the Somerset emblem is a Wyvern, but does that mean there are different representations of a Wyvern? I ask because the only Wyvern that I’ve ever seen or heard about is the one used to represent Wessex as you’ve pointed out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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