Steve1871 Posted 25 May Author Share Posted 25 May Bayonet #107. 5/24/24 S98/05nA Spine. Forgot take Pic, think was 15 or 16 Maker. V.C.Schilling Suhl Unit. Unit marked but need help All metal is Patina, blade with some pitting, pommel with some rust as well. No have time to clean it ( another project) the interesting thing is the unit mark. Unit marked butchers are scarce. This one has remains of Very Odd older mark. Usual unit markings. Only the Waffe number at the end is in the much smaller size. Under the 5, there is a SMALL 2, almost looks like a zero in front of it?. There might be more. After the. F, It looks like Roman 2 for second Army? After the 2. Is an H, I have no idea ?? to me, it reads 5. A.F D. II. H.30 have 3-4 pics of the marking, this best pic. putting stuff away, found a common /05 frog I put on it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve1871 Posted 25 May Author Share Posted 25 May Sorry been so late on this post, just took 9 days off back home, took tons pics, have several more to post each week for awhile. Hope you gents still enjoy this post once in awhile Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zuluwar2006 Posted 25 May Share Posted 25 May Steve, a war time unit marked bayonet, always is an excellent find, for my opinion!!! Good job!!! Regards, D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyBsk Posted 25 May Share Posted 25 May (edited) Nice unit marked bayonet, i personally would tend to prewar production piece max 14 dated, which means the piece was refurbished to S98/05nA standard in 1915 probably, when not so marked, the unit could be Fuss Artillerie Regt. nr.5, II.Batallion, 2.Haubitzen Batterie and weapon nr.xx. In 1914 they used this gun from german source. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/15_cm_sFH_02 Edited 25 May by AndyBsk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shippingsteel Posted 25 May Share Posted 25 May (edited) I think the unit marking should read as 5.A.F. II.2.H.30. ... which to me would indicate belonging to a Munitions column unit attached to the Niederschlesisches Fußartillerie-Regiment Nr.5 ... and reading as shown below. Fuss-Artillerie-Regiment Nr.5, 2. Bataillon Haubitze-Munitions-Kolonnen Nr.2, Waffe Nr.30 Cheers, SS Edited 25 May by shippingsteel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve1871 Posted 25 May Author Share Posted 25 May Thanks guys, interesting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Mortimer Posted 26 May Share Posted 26 May Looked this up in my reference book, there are multiple stamping variants for these units, e.g.: 1. A. F. III. l. H. 80 -> 1.Fußartillerie-Regiment, leichte Munitionskolonne des III. Bataillons (schwere Feldhaubitze 02), Waffe Nr.80 -> Howitzer guys 1. A. F. III. l. M. 80 -> 1.Fußartillerie-Regiment, leichte Munitionskolonne des III. Bataillons (Mörser), Waffe Nr.80 -> Mortar guys Then the same stamping without the cursive "L" (indicating light munitions column), meaning a normal munitions column: 1. A. F. I. 6. H. 3 -> 1.Fußartillerie-Regiment, 6. Munitionskolonne des I. Bataillons (s.F.H. 02), Waffe Nr. 3 So yours is 5.Fußartillerie-Regiment, 2. Munitionskolonne des II. Bataillons (s.F.H. 02), Waffe Nr. 30 (or 31, can't exactly make out the last number on the edge of the picture) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve1871 Posted 27 May Author Share Posted 27 May Sounds like great research there Sir Mortimer, but there is no cursive “ L”? And I am confused by your ( s.F.H.02.). Sorry I no have any reference books for units in the truck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyBsk Posted 27 May Share Posted 27 May Steve, maybe it would help the deciphering of W15 or W16 on spine?, and later look at detailed history of this FussArtillery Regiment n.r5, for me it remains possible the 2.Haubitzen Battery even a possibility of Munition collumn for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Mortimer Posted 27 May Share Posted 27 May (edited) 15 hours ago, Steve1871 said: Sounds like great research there Sir Mortimer, but there is no cursive “ L”? And I am confused by your ( s.F.H.02.). Sorry I no have any reference books for units in the truck I only used those examples to show that for this unit type it's possible to have a cursive L stamped (to indicate a light column, which yours definitely istn't!) to differentiate from a "normal" sized unit, and differentiated additionally with "H" or "M" for "howitzers" or "mortar" ammunition crew. Nothing more, nothing less. s.F.H.02 is the abbreviation for "schwere Feld-Haubitze (Modell) 02" -> see my first "stamping example" where it's typed out as a whole Edited 27 May by Sir Mortimer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shippingsteel Posted 27 May Share Posted 27 May Here is a nice little article which provides some background on the various Munitions Kolonnes. These are the guys who "fed the guns" (or in this case the Howitzers) The H stands for Haubitze ... http://www.kaiserscross.com/76001/76022.html Cheers, SS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve1871 Posted 27 May Author Share Posted 27 May Thanks again Sir Mortimer and SS I do enjoy trying to learn here, sometimes it can be wonderfully Frustrating when units merge, split apart and Armourers do their own thing. Just so amazing how many different answers can be found for the same unit marking. Hopefully, I will always be the “ Student” and keep learning. Haz anyone been able contact Julian ( Trajan) I PM the moderators. No responce, in his age and not slowing down, I worry about him. Kept teasing him to self Publish his work. He has researched and cataloged a Huge database on units and markings. Just hope he doing well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve1871 Posted 31 May Author Share Posted 31 May Out of my league here. Too rare for me to look up, no carry bunch books with me. Hey Demitrios, why not add another pic with a S.71mS beside it for comparison photo. To show if it the same blade. Still love all the rare goodies you come up with, thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve1871 Posted 16 June Author Share Posted 16 June Bayonet #108 6/16/24 KS.98 Spine. Crown W 13, crown A maker. V.C.Schilling. Suhl Unit. None Might be scarce Maker/Date combo. This one does not have unit, a lot of them do not. But it pretty good condition.very light rust/ patina, correct scabbard, one pic show frog stud has the stamp as well. Two on pommel. The few Military ( GW) ones, not Weimar stuff lately been rusty relics. KS98’s are always fun to play with. Only my third I think Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyBsk Posted 16 June Share Posted 16 June (edited) Looks like nice well used piece, visible on remains of traces of frog on scabbard, the O letter is confirmed by Suhl area in 1913. Leather grips are really damaged and are certainly not well for heavy use,even shrunked in size probably after decades. i assume from this was changed to bakelit and wood grip material in war period. Edited 16 June by AndyBsk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 16 June Share Posted 16 June According to Jackson (53), made as part of a 1913 into 1914 contract with Schilling for Prussian issue. A guess - the contract could be associated with an Allerhochste Kabinetts-Ordre of 1913 authorising issue of these bayonets to Flieger and Telegraph units also (see Jackson 70). Trajan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve1871 Posted 24 June Author Share Posted 24 June Bayonet #109. 6/23/24 I.S.71 Standard Spine. Scrubbed, none. Maker. Weyersberg & Stamm. Solingen Unit B.17.R.E.2.50. 17 Bavarian Inf. Reg. Second ersatz comp. Waffe # 50 I have many standard S.71, still no have all makers but even collecting for Regiments. A while back I wanted to clean one my S.71 pommels but luckily some members chimed I’m not to. Pommel actually has remains of the Feld Grau paint. I did not know the German Army did that. When I saw this piece, seller did not mention paint, but I got it into my head that photos looked like faded remains of Feld Grau on scabbard throat and final, maybe tiny bit in pommel grooves. Bought it. When got in hand, I not so sure anymore. Brass can/ does change color due to conditions. I do not think so now?? Bayonet Blade excellent, except spine scrubbed, guard brown/ patina, not rusted. Pommel great shape, leaf spring better that screw or guard. Single stamp on pommel. Right side guard with inventory number. Frog , both chape and final with orig. brass staples and both acceptance stamped. Throat piece stamped, leather shrunk about 2cm. I had pushed it a bit and got half the distance closed from the pic I took. Did not want force it again. Seam intact, tiny bit by chape loose, but not open, brass of scabbard either natural change in color or ( slim) chance,possible trace Feld Grau Still a good Bavarian with excellent blade with scabbard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rafal1971 Posted 24 June Share Posted 24 June Nice bayonet On the other hand, the production number Regimental markings are Ersatz Battalion, 17th Bavarian Infantry Regiment, 2 company, weapon number 50. This is the natural patina of brass. The paint would peel off. Prussian scabbard. The Bavarians used a clamp on the upper fitting in their scabbards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyBsk Posted 24 June Share Posted 24 June (edited) Yes the sharpening is little larger as obvious and scabbard would be unit marked with matching unit, in that case a prussian modell one. Right side is rifle number. Edited 24 June by AndyBsk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve1871 Posted 24 June Author Share Posted 24 June You right Andy, did not notic the sharpening, was in hurry, but still a nice bayonet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve1871 Posted 8 July Author Share Posted 8 July Bayonet # 110. and. # 111 7/7/24 S.60/71 issued and S60/71 commercial Spine None/ Ricasso crown/W/68. Crown/S Maker W. Clayberg Solingen Unit 37 R 7 118 guess simple as looks 37 Inf. Reg. 7th Komp. Waffe 118 blade with a light sheen of grey/brown, very light rust I guess. Still felt smooth. No time to clean it. Still a good and scarce to rare bayonet. crown/D on side guard, no find pic now but pommel had single crown without letter. Flat milled on side guard to see the M71 sights.. #204 on backstrap is rack, inventory number I think Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve1871 Posted 8 July Author Share Posted 8 July S60/71 commercial has no markings at all.. the guard looks like has remains of some chrome or other plating. The blade, I could not tell if very light rust or effects of removing chrome ect? The scabbard is more rare than the bayonet. On this one, same as the bayonet, no markings but scabbard shrunk maybe a CM. Leather ( black) is faded some, is all. Forgot, throat screw gone. Interesting is staple is actually narrower than a standard scabbard.. I lucked out in getting this 60/71 with scabbard for o Lu $385. Even a commercial it was a steal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve1871 Posted 8 July Author Share Posted 8 July Group pic, third one is actually an original S.60, not bushed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyBsk Posted 8 July Share Posted 8 July Normally similar bayonets are related as Artillerie SG1871 with used old 1860 blade, i assume here the unit is a Fussilier Regiment Nr.37 von Steinmetz which could use similar bayonets, converted from 1860 and Dreyse rifle to Gew1871. later was similar bayonet used by Artillerie units. The other one should be compared with dimmension as a extra piece should be lighter and smaller in size as combat one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve1871 Posted 8 July Author Share Posted 8 July (edited) Hey Andy, the commercial or “ extras” piece is same size, I guessing that they simply took regular bayonets off assembly line and set aside to make commercial , dress bayonets. They did this with the S.71Hirschfangers. I tried my dress Hirschfanger bayonets on my rifles. They fit and lock just fine Edited 8 July by Steve1871 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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