help identifying prussian soldier/numbers on uniform

[abritelight]

hi all, first time here... got a tip from a facebook genealogy group that this forum exists and might aid my research. the man in the attached photograph is my great great grandfather, michael tomkowitz, born 1882 (the photograph came from a family member). i understand that this is a prussian/german WWI uniform, but i'm unclear what the numbers on his collar mean exactly and whether they might aid me in finding any additional information on him. i've only found one record with a michael tomkowitz on it that seems like it might *possibly* fit, but without any other supporting info its very hard to tell if the record in question is the same man in the photograph. (record i am referring to is here: http://des.genealogy.net/search/show/1579115 ) 

any insight any of you have on whether the numbers on the collar can help me link him to the record in question? or help me link him to anything else at all?  i know that he lived at least the latter part of his life in/near naukritten, east prussia (no longer on the map but near present day alokhino, kaliningrad oblast, russia. the only other info i have on him is that his daughter eva was born in stolzenfeld, east prussia (now called Stopki, Poland) and that info is somewhat questionable to be bc it came from an article that was written about eva when she turned 110, and i don't know if she was recalling that from memory and whether she would have remembered that correctly at that age.)

thank you so much for your help with this photo!

[AOK4]

Hello,

Landsturm-Infanterie-Bataillon I/20. I'm not at home, so don't have access to my books. I will be able to tell more in a few days.

Jan

[charlie2]

As AOK4 has posted Landsturm Infanterie Bataillon 1/20 - the 20th Landsturm Infanterie Battalion of the 1st Army Corps. The 1st Army Corps area was roughly the northern part of East Prussia. The battalion was raised on 21.01.1916.

The Battalion’s HQ was in Heilsberg

The Companies were based in

1st Company - Angerburg

2nd - Darkehmen

3rd - Heiligenkreuz

4th - Bartenstein

5th - Gerdauen

6th - Goldap

7th - Gumbinnen

8th - Heilsberg

9th Heydekrug

10th - Insterburg

11th -Neuhausen

12th - Königsberg

13th - Labiau

14th - Memel

15th - Kaukehmen

16th - Marggrabowa

17th -  Company Pillkallen

18th - Landsberg (E. Prussia)

19th - Ragnit

20th - Rastenburg

21st - Bischofsburg

22nd - Stallupönen

23rd - Tilsit

24th - Wehlau

25th - Preußisch Eylau

Charlie

Edit - I presume it is your family tree on Ancestry

Edited 5 March , 2023 by charlie2

[Svenja]

Hi

The Michael Tomkowitz you found in the Casuality list of the German Army of 20 November 1915 was in the 4th Company of the Landsturm Infanterie Bataillon Königsberg (I/11.) He was born in Morczyn, Thorn (Westprussia) and he was severly wounded. You should search for the birth/baptism record of his daughter and himself. If you need help to find such records you should write to the German genealogy forum www.ahnenforschung.net, there are people who know which records still exist and in which archives they can be found.

Regards

Svenja

[abritelight]

thanks everyone, this is definitely helpful! since my relative's uniform identifies him as in the 20th Landsturm Infanterie Battalion and the person in the record is identified as being in the 4th Company of the Landsturm Infanterie Bataillon, i hope it is safe for me to assume that these are two different men. i will continue searching for records and documents, and if anyone has additional info or tips not yet mentioned here i would appreciate it, thanks so much! 

 

-lisa anne

 

 

 

9 hours ago, charlie2 said:

Edit - I presume it is your family tree on Ancestry

hi charlie,

i do have a tree on ancestry, but not sure what you're referring to about it here in your comment? thanks for all the info on the companies! when you say 'based in' is that similar to being 'stationed in'?

[charlie2]

33 minutes ago, abritelight said:

i do have a tree on ancestry,

I only asked to be sure it was yours and therefore avoid telling you something you already knew.

36 minutes ago, abritelight said:

hope it is safe for me to assume that these are two different men

Unless you have evidence that your G G Grandfather wasn‘t born in Morczyn it would be unwise to assume they are two different people. The Michael in the casualty lists was wounded in 1915 with the 11th Battalion and your photo was taken sometime after January 1916, it is possible that after he recovered from his wound he did not rejoin the 11th Battalion but was posted to the 20th instead.

45 minutes ago, abritelight said:

when you say 'based in' is that similar to being 'stationed in'?

Exactly the same.

 

[abritelight]

19 hours ago, AOK4 said:

Hello,

Landsturm-Infanterie-Bataillon I/20. I'm not at home, so don't have access to my books. I will be able to tell more in a few days.

Jan

thanks so much jan, appreciate that especially if you have info beyond what else has been shared here.

warmly,

lisa anne

 

[abritelight]

8 hours ago, charlie2 said:

Unless you have evidence that your G G Grandfather wasn‘t born in Morczyn it would be unwise to assume they are two different people. The Michael in the casualty lists was wounded in 1915 with the 11th Battalion and your photo was taken sometime after January 1916, it is possible that after he recovered from his wound he did not rejoin the 11th Battalion but was posted to the 20th instead.

okay thanks for this, can you tell i'm an amateur? i wouldn't have crossed my mind that it works that way, this is the first time i am digging into the family members who served in the military so i didn't realize. very helpful!  and thanks for asking my question about 'based in'.

 

cheers

 

[charlie2]

3 hours ago, abritelight said:

this is the first time i am digging into the family members who served in the military

Forgive me if know this already

The records of the Prussian Army were destroyed in an air raid in 1945.

Before the Great War military service in Germany was compulsory, all men aged between 18 and their 46th birthday were liable to be called up, usually when they were about 20. Not all men were called up and those that were not were placed in the Landsturm and had no military obligations. The Landsturm was a pool of suitable men that could be called to serve if the need arose. Due to his age in 1914 (about 32) your G G Grandfather would seem to fit in this category.

LIB 1/11 was mobilised at the outbreak of war and was attached to the 77th Reserve Division on the eastern front at the time the person in the casualty list was wounded. The casualty list is dated 20th November 1915, the lists were published about 6 weeks later than the actual occurrence. LIB 1/20 was not mobilised and was employed in the homeland guarding railway stations, bridges etc. It is a possibility (and  only that) that the person wounded in 1915 was no longer fit for further active service but was fit enough to continue to serve in the homeland and was therefore transferred to the 1/20.

Charlie

[abritelight]

11 hours ago, charlie2 said:

Forgive me if know this already

The records of the Prussian Army were destroyed in an air raid in 1945.

Before the Great War military service in Germany was compulsory, all men aged between 18 and their 46th birthday were liable to be called up, usually when they were about 20. Not all men were called up and those that were not were placed in the Landsturm and had no military obligations. The Landsturm was a pool of suitable men that could be called to serve if the need arose. Due to his age in 1914 (about 32) your G G Grandfather would seem to fit in this category.

LIB 1/11 was mobilised at the outbreak of war and was attached to the 77th Reserve Division on the eastern front at the time the person in the casualty list was wounded. The casualty list is dated 20th November 1915, the lists were published about 6 weeks later than the actual occurrence. LIB 1/20 was not mobilised and was employed in the homeland guarding railway stations, bridges etc. It is a possibility (and  only that) that the person wounded in 1915 was no longer fit for further active service but was fit enough to continue to serve in the homeland and was therefore transferred to the 1/20.

Charlie

definitely appreciate all this info! i've gathered that a lot of the documents from prussia had been destroyed but didn't know about military docs and this air strike specifically. thanks for also sharing a bit more about how the military system worked there at the time  

[AOK4]

Hello,

I/20 was immobil which means it was a unit that didn't serve on the front. Looking at the many companies spread all over East Prussia, I would assume this unit was used to guard critically important places (railroads, depots etc) or perhaps even POW camps.

It would not be illogical for a man to serve in such a unit after being wounded and not being kv any more (kriegsdienstverwendungsfähig), but being only gv (garnisondienstverwendingsfähig).

Jan

[abritelight]

12 minutes ago, AOK4 said:

Hello,

I/20 was immobil which means it was a unit that didn't serve on the front. Looking at the many companies spread all over East Prussia, I would assume this unit was used to guard critically important places (railroads, depots etc) or perhaps even POW camps.

It would not be illogical for a man to serve in such a unit after being wounded and not being kv any more (kriegsdienstverwendungsfähig), but being only gv (garnisondienstverwendingsfähig).

Jan

hi jan, thanks for following up here. that info is definitely helpful. i don't have documents to prove or disprove my ancestor being the person in the military record i linked to in the post above, but did find out that all the family towns i have names for are about 190 miles away from thorn, where the person in the record was born.  i don't know a ton about migration in prussia in that time period, like how often someone of modest means would move that far away from where they were born, but does seem sort of unlikely to me. (though trying to be a good genealogist and stick with facts and not gut feelings! )

thanks again!