Photo Album - 1/4th Gloucestershire, Scottish Regiments. France, Italy, England.

[gunnerwalker]

11 minutes ago, PRC said:

Newspaper image of Captain Frederick Dudley Andrews looks like a printers block version of the photograph held by the Imperial War Museum.

There is an F.D. Andrews on the Great War Memorial in the Chapel at Rossall School https://www.iwm.org.uk/memorials/item/memorial/42680

Unfortunately links to the school archive, such as https://archive.rossall.org.uk all just seem to time out.

According to that January 1917 British Army Monthly List, 2nd Lieutenant F.D. Andrews was locally promoted Captain effective 13th September 1916, which presumably provides a date before which the picture needs to have been taken if he is the same man in your photograph number 3

Cheers,
Peter

I'm expecting a published copy of the war diary in the post so hopefully that will have something for me that I may have missed in the original handwritten version.

Going through the officers list for the battalion you provided he is the only Andrews at that time, https://digital.nls.uk/british-military-lists/archive/103214185, though plenty of time between summer 1916 and January 1917 for other Andrews' to come and go from the battalion due to a multitude of reasons.

I note that C. M. Welsby is marked as still being on probation, as is F. J. Stone. If the number before their names denotes the battalion (1, 2 or 3 being 1/4th, 2/4th or 3/4th), then they both show as being with the 3/4th but maybe this is not an updated list or that is a reflection of them still being on probation.

There are three Lt. Lowes; R. Lowe (as mentioned in Wyrall) who I believe is marked as 1/4th Battalion, H. M. E. Lowe marked 3/4th, and S. A. E. Lowe also marked 3/4th.

Edited 15 October , 2023 by gunnerwalker

[PRC]

10 hours ago, gunnerwalker said:

If the number before their names denotes the battalion

It does - or rather whether they were with the 1st Line, 2nd Line or 3rd Line Battalion of the 4th. If someone was serving with the 1st Regular Army Battalion then the number would be shown in brackets (1).

10 hours ago, gunnerwalker said:

but maybe this is not an updated list or that is a reflection of them still being on probation.

The Army lists are just a starting point and shouldn't be treated by themselves as an accurate statement at that point in time. But what's there gives you a place to begin searching for additional supporting sources. There are certainly delays in picking up changes, particularly when it's the kind of thing like a Battalion change which wouldn't appear in the London Gazette. I would assume the team preparing the monthly, quarterly and annual army lists would also have been drawing on returns from the various records offices to supplement the London Gazette notices. And as with so many other things the records offices were responsible for I've no doubt the quality varied enormously - think other ranks service records and casualty lists.

Each month can be an odd mix - if you scroll to the end of the list of the 2nd Lieutenants on the establishment of the 4th Battalion the last three entries were commissioned on the 19th December 1916 yet were included in a publication that came out in the opening week of January 1917.

I'm sure you will also spot officers who were deceased - some more recently that others although bear in mind at the time the list was published their official status could have been "Missing". And some of a Battalions Officers may well have been prisoners of war or in the medical chain - I note that Lieutenant and local Captain E.E. Wooley, the company commander in the 1/4th that you mentioned as wounded in early November 1916, is still shown as 1/4th.

Officers' on probation could still be sent to a Theatre of War - at that stage of the war this was a routine step to being confirmed in commission.

Cheers,
Peter

[gunnerwalker]

1 hour ago, PRC said:

I note that Lieutenant and local Captain E.E. Wooley, the company commander in the 1/4th that you mentioned as wounded in early November 1916, is still shown as 1/4th.

Captain Wookey seems to have remained with the battalion when they went to Italy later in 1917, where he was promoted Major. So his wound may not have been too serious so as to remove him from the battalion for too long. But I take your point.

Were earlier lists compiled or is 1917 the first reliable one? There isn't one for the beginning of 1916 is there?

[PRC]

2 hours ago, gunnerwalker said:

Were earlier lists compiled or is 1917 the first reliable one? There isn't one for the beginning of 1916 is there?

Fill your boots - all the annual, quarterly and monthly Army lists available on the National Library of Scotland website can be found here https://digital.nls.uk/british-military-lists/archive/88735803

Reliable to a limited degree - I only chose January 1917 as I was looking for individuals who were serving as officers during 1916 and were still believed to be alive. Any month in 1916 raised the odds I would need to check a second month  - for me it was a quick and dirty search so I was trying to avoid that until I'd had a first run through the pictures you had posted!

Cheers,
Peter

[PRC]

On 14/10/2023 at 15:36, gunnerwalker said:

The officer on the right is Lieutenant Walter Bell Burns. He was born in Argentina to Alexander and Herminia Burns and educated at University College School, London. Walter was living in Argentina in 1914 at the outbreak of war but returned to Great Britain to enlist.

There is a contemporary booklet published to raise funds of a charity that featured the names of the British expats who returned from Agentina to offer their services. Many of the names and bio’s were accompanied by a picture. I believe it used to be on the likes of Ancestry or FindMyPast, but I can’t reminder what it was called. Just posting this in case it rings a bell with anyone.

On 14/10/2023 at 15:40, gunnerwalker said:

7. - 'Capt Cassell'.

This one stumped me for a while until I came across a Captain Castle in Wyrall. He is Gilbert Stacey Castle, seen wearing his MC ribbon though I have not found information on when he was awarded his MC.

When researching Gilbert, I found a very interesting photograph on British Army Ancestors in which Gilbert is shown among a group of officers from various regiments at the Fourth Army School at Flixécourt - https://www.britisharmyancestors.co.uk/blog/siegfried-sassoon-did-your-british-army-ancestor-serve-with-him/. The photo dates from May 1916, and seated in the front row is one of Gilbert's classmates, Siegfried Sassoon. In another post, owner Paul Nixon reveals that the photo was owned by Gilbert and he named all the officers in the photo on the rear - https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/british-army-ancestors-hits-100k-photograph-milestone-paul-nixon/.

The London Gazette entry has already been identified in an earlier post. And if you have discovered the delights of the British Newspaper Archive at your local library today, then you are probably aware of these reports, with more in December 1916.

 

Image courtesy FindMyPast.

While the order of the names on the Fourth Army School photograph isn’t 100% clear, (the middle row is staggered in the photograph), judging from the cap and collar badges, this would appear to be Captain Castle.

 

No new IP is claimed for the above, and all image rights, if any, remain with the current owners.

Cheers,
Peter

[gunnerwalker]

5 hours ago, PRC said:

Fill your boots - all the annual, quarterly and monthly Army lists available on the National Library of Scotland website can be found here https://digital.nls.uk/british-military-lists/archive/88735803

Reliable to a limited degree - I only chose January 1917 as I was looking for individuals who were serving as officers during 1916 and were still believed to be alive. Any month in 1916 raised the odds I would need to check a second month  - for me it was a quick and dirty search so I was trying to avoid that until I'd had a first run through the pictures you had posted!

Cheers,
Peter

Many thanks, I want to have a browse through at some point and see what changes occur between each list.

[gunnerwalker]

2 hours ago, PRC said:

There is a contemporary booklet published to raise funds of a charity that featured the names of the British expats who returned from Agentina to offer their services. Many of the names and bio’s were accompanied by a picture. I believe it used to be on the likes of Ancestry or FindMyPast, but I can’t reminder what it was called. Just posting this in case it rings a bell with anyone.

Excellent, I'll go through it a see if I can spot Lt. Burns.

 

2 hours ago, PRC said:

The London Gazette entry has already been identified in an earlier post. And if you have discovered the delights of the British Newspaper Archive at your local library today, then you are probably aware of these reports, with more in December 1916.

 

I didn't today, but I may be able to get hold of copies from home now.

[gunnerwalker]

On 14/10/2023 at 17:59, gunnerwalker said:

Captain Castle also appears to be wearing a second ribbon although I can't quite make it out. 

I've just found another former student of Bristol Grammar School, in Volume 14: Issue No. 3 for December 1916.

On page 143, under the section 'THE OLD BOYS' SOCIETY - THE WAR', it covers recent deaths and awards since the previous edition (July) of former pupils fighting in the war. At the bottom of the page it reads:

"Captain G. S. Castle won the Military Cross 'for conspicuous gallantry in action. He was in command of a company, which with one other, took an enemy first line trench by assault. When the other company commander was killed, he took charge of both companies, and held the position against bombing attacks.' In addition he won the coveted French Croix de Guerre."

---

EDIT. - The larger section of the passage reads:

"Major E. C. Slade, who has added to his Military Cross the further honour of the D.S.O.

Captain G. S. Castle won the Military Cross 'for conspicuous gallantry in action. He was in command of a company, which with one other, took an enemy first line trench by assault. When the other company commander was killed, he took charge of both companies, and held the position against bombing attacks.' In addition he won the coveted French Croix de Guerre.

Sec-Lieut. F. A. Ridler, Gloucester Regt., won the Military Cross for the conspicuous coolness and courage with which he rallied and brought out of action the company when Captain F. J. Hannam fell. Lieut. S. C. Booker, Worcester Regt., won the same distinction for conspicuous gallantry. Assisted by another officer and two men, he brought in fourteen wounded men from 'No Man's Land' under heavy fire. Next day, with two men, he brought in a wounded officer from within thirty yards of the enemy's parapet. He was searching for a brother Old Boy, Second-Lieut. W. J. Langford, whom alas ! he did not find, and he has now fallen when engaged on a similar errand of mercy, betrayed by the moon when within close range of the German trenches. 

Second-Lieut. Leonard King, Gloucester Regt., won his Cross also for conspicuous gallantry. "He led his platoon under very heavy machine-gun fire after suffering severe casualties. On the next night he showed great coolness in steadying his men during a heavy bombardment."

 

I believe this whole passage describes the same action at Ovillers, 16th-18th July 1916, which I detailed in my initial write-up for Captain Castle. Major Slade and a Lieutenant Fisher led the bombing attacks of C Company which relieved the pinned down D Company. 

2nd Lieutenant F. A. Ridler, MC, appears in the Army List of January 1917. 

 

Edited 16 October , 2023 by gunnerwalker

[PRC]

On 14/10/2023 at 15:40, gunnerwalker said:

8. - 'Huts at Con'. I believe 'Con' is Contalmaison, where the battalion billeted after coming out of the line in early November 1916 - around the time when Captain Wookey was wounded and Lieutenants Matthews and Phippen were killed. The man in the centre appears to be Lieutenant Stone.

On 14/10/2023 at 15:40, gunnerwalker said:

9. - '2/Lt Lowe, left, 2/Lt Stone, right, in our hut at Con'. 

Sorry - been trying to go through the pictures in order, so hadn't realised we had some more potential pictures of Lieutenant Stone. I don't think picture 4 really adds anything to help distinguish him as it's so dark, so haven't included it in this line up of potential matches.

No new IP is claimed for the above, and all image rights, if any, remain with the current owner.

On 14/10/2023 at 15:40, gunnerwalker said:

2/Lieutenant Lowe appears to be Harlowe Robert Lowe, later Captain, who was awarded the Military Cross. Wyrall has a note for a Capt. R. Lowe being awarded the MC in November 1918 while the 1/4th Battalion was in Italy.

Harlowe gets a mention in connection with an award to one of his brothers. Both were pupils at Gresham Public School in Norfolk. Apparently Harlowe was a member of the School OTC and in 1912 Band Corporal.

https://greshamsatwar.co.uk/Filename.ashx?systemFileName=GRESSDTW0000010.pdf&origFilename=GRESSDTW0000010.pdf

The Gresham School archive don't appear to have anything online for him that I could readily find, but there are pictures of the OTC band in 1912 and the OTC Camps at Aldershot and Windsor in 1911 and 1912.  May be worthwhile contacting the school archivist - after all if a positive identification can be obtained then I'm sure they'd appreciate a copy of this picture in exchange! https://www.greshams.com/archives/

Cheers,
Peter

[gunnerwalker]

51 minutes ago, PRC said:

Harlowe gets a mention in connection with an award to one of his brothers. Both were pupils at Gresham Public School in Norfolk. Apparently Harlowe was a member of the School OTC and in 1912 Band Corporal.

https://greshamsatwar.co.uk/Filename.ashx?systemFileName=GRESSDTW0000010.pdf&origFilename=GRESSDTW0000010.pdf

The Gresham School archive don't appear to have anything online for him that I could readily find, but there are pictures of the OTC band in 1912 and the OTC Camps at Aldershot and Windsor in 1911 and 1912.  May be worthwhile contacting the school archivist - after all if a positive identification can be obtained then I'm sure they'd appreciate a copy of this picture in exchange! https://www.greshams.com/archives/

Cheers,
Peter

Email sent to the archivist. Many thanks.

[gunnerwalker]

5 hours ago, PRC said:

The London Gazette entry has already been identified in an earlier post. And if you have discovered the delights of the British Newspaper Archive at your local library today, then you are probably aware of these reports, with more in December 1916.

 

Image courtesy FindMyPast.

 

While the order of the names on the Fourth Army School photograph isn’t 100% clear, (the middle row is staggered in the photograph), judging from the cap and collar badges, this would appear to be Captain Castle.

 

Western Daily Press, Bristol, 23rd September 1916. Text second paragraph down from the top left, image bottom right.

 

Cheltenham Chronicle and Gloucestershire Graphic, 30th September 1916. Also mentioned are several other officers from the same action at Ovillers.

 

Bristol Times and Mirror, December 1916 (couldn't make out the day).

 

Gloucester Journal, 16th December 1916.

 

 

[gunnerwalker]

Just now, gunnerwalker said:

Gloucester Journal, 16th December 1916.

 

 

 

On the same page of the Gloucester Journal appears this.

Mentions for Frederick D. Andrews, as well as Lieutenant Fisher (action at Ovillers July 1916) and newly Acting-Captain Trapnell (in write-up for photo 6 - Captain Wookey mentions in his diary Trapnell leading No. 7 Platoon, C Company, in the attack on the Leipzig Redoubt 21st August 1916).

[PRC]

51 minutes ago, gunnerwalker said:

Western Daily Press, Bristol, 23rd September 1916.

Second go at comparing likely images of Captain Castle.

No new IP is claimed for the above, and all image rights, if any, remain with the current owners.

Cheers,
Peter

 

[PRC]

On 14/10/2023 at 15:42, gunnerwalker said:

10. - 'J.Y.B. France 1917'. He is the only person mentioned by initials rather than by name, so perhaps he is the owner of the photo album? I'm not sure if he wears the uniform of the Argyle & Sutherland Highlanders though. I can't quite tell if he is the same person as in pictures 1, 11, 17, 19 and 23, or if he is one of two men who look very alike.

Picture 23 has too little detail to be able to scale up to the same size as the other five pictures, so to include it would be a distraction.

No new IP is claimed for the above, and all image rights, if any, remain with the current owners.

I think 10 and 17 could well be the same man, and the same for 11 and 19, who might also be a match for 23.

I'm not sure 1 is either man, physically look closer to Lieutenant Stone. It's difficult to tell if he deliberately extending his chin and jawline in order to keep his Brodie in place. Ears look like 11/19, but eyebrows look wrong.

Cheers,
Peter

Edited 17 October , 2023 by PRC
Typos

[FROGSMILE]

3 minutes ago, PRC said:

Picture 23 has too little detail to be able to scale up to the same size as the other five pictures, so to include it would be a distraction.

No new IP is claimed for the above, and all image rights, if any, remain with the current owners.

I think 10 and 17 could well be the same man, and the same for 11 and 19, who might also be a match for 23.

I'm not sure 1 is either man, physically look closer to Lieutenant Stone. It's difficult to tell if he deliberately extending his chin and jawline in order to keep his Brodie in place. Ears look like 11/19, but eyebrows look wrong.

Cheers,
Peter

Excellent comparators Peter, you have made an assessment very easy.  For what it’s worth, after careful examination, I’d happily wager that all of those photos are of the same man. 

Edited 17 October , 2023 by FROGSMILE

[gunnerwalker]

20 hours ago, PRC said:

Second go at comparing likely images of Captain Castle.

No new IP is claimed for the above, and all image rights, if any, remain with the current owners.

Cheers,
Peter

 

Thanks Peter. Definitely seems to be one and the same to me. Glad to have found plenty of different sources for him. He seems to have been quite the local celebrity, no doubt helped by his father being a recognised name in the area.

[gunnerwalker]

7 hours ago, PRC said:

Picture 23 has too little detail to be able to scale up to the same size as the other five pictures, so to include it would be a distraction.

No new IP is claimed for the above, and all image rights, if any, remain with the current owners.

I think 10 and 17 could well be the same man, and the same for 11 and 19, who might also be a match for 23.

I'm not sure 1 is either man, physically look closer to Lieutenant Stone. It's difficult to tell if he deliberately extending his chin and jawline in order to keep his Brodie in place. Ears look like 11/19, but eyebrows look wrong.

Cheers,
Peter

Thanks again Peter. I agree - 11 and 19 are almost certainly the same man and 10 and 17 are also likely the same. Haven't ruled out the possibility they are the same person as there is a very close likeness, but the uniform differs. I don't know enough about the elements of Scottish uniforms to know if these are just typical of different variations they available dependent on the weather.

Photo 1 is definitely an outlier, and thanks to FROGSMILE's uniform analysis it's pointing to him being Highland Light Infantry. Looking at the lists of Jan 1917, there are several officers attached to the battalion at that time from the HLI: E. Broadhead; P. Leith (I think his second initial is F. but it's faded); J. Mitchell; H. McClelland; M. H. Laughland; J. B. Young; T. W. Wallace; J. G. Shuttleton. All are listed as 2nd Lieutenants. Perhaps he's one of them.

[FROGSMILE]

13 minutes ago, gunnerwalker said:

Thanks again Peter. I agree - 11 and 19 are almost certainly the same man and 10 and 17 are also likely the same. Haven't ruled out the possibility they are the same person as there is a very close likeness, but the uniform differs. I don't know enough about the elements of Scottish uniforms to know if these are just typical of different variations they available dependent on the weather.

Photo 1 is definitely an outlier, and thanks to FROGSMILE's uniform analysis it's pointing to him being Highland Light Infantry. Looking at the lists of Jan 1917, there are several officers attached to the battalion at that time from the HLI: E. Broadhead; P. Leith (I think his second initial is F. but it's faded); J. Mitchell; H. McClelland; M. H. Laughland; J. B. Young; T. W. Wallace; J. G. Shuttleton. All are listed as 2nd Lieutenants. Perhaps he's one of them.

All the uniforms are service dress, they’ve just been photographed in different conditions of light and shade.  Collar badges are the same where visible too.  I’ve no doubt whatsoever that they’re all images of the same officer.  He has quite striking facial features that make him quite distinctive.

I agree that HLI fits insignia wise too.

Edited 17 October , 2023 by FROGSMILE

[gunnerwalker]

1 minute ago, FROGSMILE said:

All the uniforms are service dress, they’ve just been photographed in different conditions of light and shade.  Collar badges are the same where visible too.  I’ve no doubt whatsoever that they’re all images of the same officer.  He has quite striking facial features that make him quite distinctive.

It's the variations of legwear which I haven't been sure about. If the same person then he goes between tartan trews, service dress trousers and shorts, and then dependent on these wears long socks or puttees. Is it common to have this many variations at one's disposal?

8 hours ago, PRC said:

Picture 23 has too little detail to be able to scale up to the same size as the other five pictures, so to include it would be a distraction.

No new IP is claimed for the above, and all image rights, if any, remain with the current owners.

I think 10 and 17 could well be the same man, and the same for 11 and 19, who might also be a match for 23.

I'm not sure 1 is either man, physically look closer to Lieutenant Stone. It's difficult to tell if he deliberately extending his chin and jawline in order to keep his Brodie in place. Ears look like 11/19, but eyebrows look wrong.

Cheers,
Peter

I forgot to add, under a loupe photo 23 is a lot clearer than the scan scaled up. 23 looks very much like 11 and pulls an expression alike 17, so likely the same man yes.

[FROGSMILE]

50 minutes ago, gunnerwalker said:

It's the variations of legwear which I haven't been sure about. If the same person then he goes between tartan trews, service dress trousers and shorts, and then dependent on these wears long socks or puttees. Is it common to have this many variations at one's disposal?

I forgot to add, under a loupe photo 23 is a lot clearer than the scan scaled up. 23 looks very much like 11 and pulls an expression alike 17, so likely the same man yes.

Yes the HLI were known to wear shorts made from SD and even tartan, but in general shorts were sometimes worn in summer weather on the Western Front by various units.  See: 

 

Edited 17 October , 2023 by FROGSMILE

[gunnerwalker]

5 minutes ago, FROGSMILE said:

Yes the HLI were known to wear shorts made from SD and even tartan, but in general shorts were sometimes worn in summer weather on the Western Front by various units.

Well maybe he is the same man then. As you say, the collar badges are a similar shape, but no definition to be absolutely sure. I'm slowly piecing together an understanding the differences in Scottish uniforms. Perhaps this is also helps to explain why there are so many photos of one man but only one named (J.Y.B.).

[PRC]

Not sure if this advances things much, but here's 1, 10, 11, 17 and 19 as full as I can get them, with a bit of playing around with sharpness, tone and contrast plus letting the software do an auto-tidy, so apologies if I've let it smooth out any buttons, which it has a tendency to do.

No new IP is claimed for the above, and all image rights, if any, remain with the current owner.

1, 10 and 17 appear to show rank worn on cuff, and is probably a 2nd Lieutenant, 11 I don't think we can be sure about his rank and I don't think I can see any cuff markings on 19.
Could be a total co-incidence that 11 and 19 to me look like the same man.

So is the consensus now that 1 is serving with the Highland Light Infantry?
If so, and should it turn out they are all the same man, then that gives a unit for all of them - even though he might be attached to another unit like the Gloucestershire Regiment.

Cheers,
Peter

 

 

[FROGSMILE]

36 minutes ago, PRC said:

Not sure if this advances things much, but here's 1, 10, 11, 17 and 19 as full as I can get them, with a bit of playing around with sharpness, tone and contrast plus letting the software do an auto-tidy, so apologies if I've let it smooth out any buttons, which it has a tendency to do.

No new IP is claimed for the above, and all image rights, if any, remain with the current owner.

1, 10 and 17 appear to show rank worn on cuff, and is probably a 2nd Lieutenant, 11 I don't think we can be sure about his rank and I don't think I can see any cuff markings on 19.
Could be a total co-incidence that 11 and 19 to me look like the same man.

So is the consensus now that 1 is serving with the Highland Light Infantry?
If so, and should it turn out they are all the same man, then that gives a unit for all of them - even though he might be attached to another unit like the Gloucestershire Regiment.

Cheers,
Peter

 

 

Yes I think so Peter.  The regiment favoured white metal collar badges matching their cap badge, although much later on adopted bronze types in some battalions so that both types can be seen contemporaneously.  The wm badges are visible in many of the photos and chime with the MacKenzie tartan trews.

Edited 17 October , 2023 by FROGSMILE

[gunnerwalker]

6 minutes ago, PRC said:

Not sure if this advances things much, but here's 1, 10, 11, 17 and 19 as full as I can get them, with a bit of playing around with sharpness, tone and contrast plus letting the software do an auto-tidy, so apologies if I've let it smooth out any buttons, which it has a tendency to do.

No new IP is claimed for the above, and all image rights, if any, remain with the current owner.

1, 10 and 17 appear to show rank worn on cuff, and is probably a 2nd Lieutenant, 11 I don't think we can be sure about his rank and I don't think I can see any cuff markings on 19.
Could be a total co-incidence that 11 and 19 to me look like the same man.

So is the consensus now that 1 is serving with the Highland Light Infantry?
If so, and should it turn out they are all the same man, then that gives a unit for all of them - even though he might be attached to another unit like the Gloucestershire Regiment.

Cheers,
Peter

 

 

I agree with FROGSMILE also. I'm looking carefully at photo 10, both my scan and the actual photo under a loupe. On his tam o' shanter I can make out the three points defining the edge of the cap badge, and also perhaps the raised part of the bugle is catching the light further suggesting HLI is correct. Not 100% but definitely has the right shape to the badge. 

Also, now I think about it, it's the differing headwear between the photos that's been skewing my convictions about whether it's the same man in all five. The tam o' shanter makes his head look a lot taller and therefore proportionally a lot thinner than the ones where he is bare-headed. If I try and ignore this I'm much more convinced. 

The same front on angle also allows a fair comparison of the ear shape in 17 and 19, and they look consistent to me.

[gunnerwalker]

1 hour ago, gunnerwalker said:

Looking at the lists of Jan 1917, there are several officers attached to the battalion at that time from the HLI: E. Broadhead; P. Leith (I think his second initial is F. but it's faded); J. Mitchell; H. McClelland; M. H. Laughland; J. B. Young; T. W. Wallace; J. G. Shuttleton. All are listed as 2nd Lieutenants. Perhaps he's one of them.

WHY IN THE BLAZES did I not clock this as I was writing it. Photo 10 is inscribed "J.B.Y.".