Looking for help with George ROSE, Gunner, Royal Garrison Artillery

[BevHerbert]

Hello,

Please would anyone be able to help with any pointers as to how I can uncover more information about my Great Grandfather George ROSE and his WWI Service? I have included what little I already know below.

I noticed (properly!) for the first time today that my Great Grandfather is described on his marriage certificate (1/4/1916) as a Gunner, R.G.A with no further details. I have been onto Ancestry and FMP but a search for George ROSE Royal Garrison Artillery brings up a number of options and none of the records I have found really give any other distinguishing information for me to narrow it down. These are the service numbers  that I have found so far (all "George ROSE" Gunner with R.G.A)

129267 (previously with 78 Coy)

80514 (this gentleman sadly died during the war so I have ruled him out)

168388

56503

22196

27599

225252

My Great Grandfather was born in Charing, Kent in 1885. In 1911 he was living in Deal, Kent and (I think, writing isn't great) is described as a Reservist & Labourer. His marriage certificate in 1916 gives his address as 5 New Street, Deal and by 1921 he is working as a Window Cleaner back in Deal.

I have tried a few other searches that I have seen suggested; pension records, absent voter lists, service records but nothing obvious came to light. I am going to try and search Newspapers to see if George ROSE and any of these service numbers come up together with more information.  I also wondered if his being a reservist back in 1911 might have any impact on where his records could be found and/or what date they may be recorded under. 

I have attached a photo (from his wedding day 1916) that shows him in uniform (in case that helps to confirm or deny!) 

Many thanks if anyone can help.

 

Bev

 

Edited 17 May by BevHerbert
Incorrect photo added in error, removed

[PRC]

Hard to be sure as the resolution isn't too great, but I think there is just enough details to work out he is wearing the Royal Artillery capbadge - unfortunately the same one was worn by the Royal Garrison Artillery, the Royal Field Artillery, and the Royal Horse Artillery.

No new IP is claimed for the above, and all image rights, if any, remain with the current owners.

Cheers,
Peter

 

 

[BevHerbert]

Thanks Peter - yes, sorry about the image quality!

[mancpal]

Bev,

I can’t really help with your questions. I would however like to congratulate you on providing the detail you have already which will no doubt save members their time rather than going over old ground (not all do and it can be frustrating to post on a thread only to find the OP already knows the information). Good luck with your quest.

Simon

[mancpal]

Bev,

I’ve had another look at the photo and whilst I’m not a uniform expert in any way I have the following thought. 
Given the Kent connection I suspect the Sergeant on the left could be a member of the ‘Buffs’ (East Kent Regiment). I can’t even guess at the other two cap badges I’m afraid though to my eye they may be of the same regiment .

Simon

[mancpal]

Bev,

the other two could be Royal Engineers though this really is stretching it. Perhaps they were siblings of the groom or could it be the brides family on one side and the grooms on the other? 
I promise to leave you alone now as it’s my tea time !

Simon

[ororkep]

Your 27599 is actually a George William ROSE. if you are including a middle name then you have about seven others to consider as well with middle names beginning with A, H & W.

Obviously he can be excluded if your George had no middle name.

22196 was attached to RAMC

56503 served with 37 Siege Battery and was awarded a MM

168388 was probably with a AA Bty

129267 was with 78 Coy with British Medal only.

225252 was formally RFA Driver 31253 (was he good with horses?)

Rgds Paul

[Michelle Young]

The other two might be RMLI? 

[mancpal]

If his marriage certificate states RGA then that should rule out the other two branches of the Artillery (up to that point of course). I’d also suspect a middle name would appear on his marriage certificate  which would rule out some other Georges on the medal index cards.

Simon

[RussT]

He is 25 years old on the 1911 census.

There is a possibility he didn't serve overseas - so no MIC/Medal Roll

But let's assume he did, so out of the possible ones you list:

129267 is an RGA number allotted in November 1916.

168388 is a new army number allotted in May 1917

27599 is, as mentioned above, a man with the middle name William. He was discharged totally blind on 17/03/1916 - so also does not align with the marriage photo or marriage certificate dated 01/04/1916.

56503 is a short service duration of the war man enlisting in December 1914

225252 was an RGA number allotted in 1918

22196 would have been a regular soldier enlisting into the RGA in January 1905 for 3 years with the colours and 9 on the reserve. As noted above, he was attached to the RAMC (1st General Hospital according to his 1914 Star Medal Roll) and entering France on 18/08/1914. This man fits the known facts/observations:

 - He would have been around 19 to 20 years old on enlistment,

- He would be a reservist on the 1911 census as he would have completed his 3 years with the colours in 1908/1909,

- He would have been eligible for being mobilised as a reservist upon the outbreak of war in August 1914.

- He would have been a likely candidate to go out early to France in August 1914 as a re-called Reservist.

Therefore, my money is on him being 22196 George Rose RGA, attached RAMC - entitled to the Trio. Perhaps you can track down which member of the family might have this medals - and then check what details are impressed upon them.

Regards

Russ

 

[RussT]

The War Diary for the No 1 General Hospital states that this RAMC unit was mobilised on 6th August 1914. During its preparations it records that on the 9th August 1914, a Sergeant and 20 Gunners of the RGA joined them from the No 3 RGA Depot at Plymouth and were being lent to the unit as Batmen (see image courtesy TNA).

The No 1 GH embarked on 18/08/1914 and docked at Havre on 20/08/1918.

The 1914 Medal Roll page on which 22196 G Rose appears has 3 other men on it as being attached to the No 1 GH. The page before has 12 men on it (attached No 1 GH) and the page after has 7 (attached No 1 GH). That's 23 men in total - all with the rank Gunner. Twelve are recorded as disembarking on the 10/08/1914, two on the 17/08/1914, six on the 18/08/1914 (including George Rose), two on the 19/08/1914, and 1 on 03/10/1914.

Of course we can't say whether he remained with the No 1 GH throughout the war but we can note that his VM/BWM Medal Roll does say he was attached to the RAMC so it is likely he did - or at least he was with some RAMC unit throughout.

Regards

Russ

 

[RussT]

You can look for Service Records for the other 20-odd RGA men who were also attached to the No 1 GH as per their 1914 Medal Roll.

Gunner 20866 Albert Hayes enlisted 13/09/1904 for a 3 + 9 Term of Engagement.

He was transferred to the 1st Class Army Reserve on 12/09/1907 upon completion of his Colour Service.

He was mobilised at the Plymouth RGA Depot and posted to the No 1 General Hospital on 05/08/1914.

His 1914 Medal Roll also states he disembarked for France on 18/08/1914 as does his Service Record - and as per that for Rose on his 1914 Medal Roll

He left the RAMC unit and joined 113th Heavy Battery on 20/01/1915 - his record provides all his later RGA-unit postings.

His VM/BWM Medal Roll does NOT state "Attached RAMC" (unlike that for George Rose) but just the very common "RGA Base Details".

I would conclude from this evidence therefore that George did indeed remain attached to an RAMC unit throughout his Service (possibly with the No 1 GH).

I would recommend going through the whole of the No 1 GH War Diary - it's free - you never know, he might be mentioned in it. But of course only if you think there is a possibility it's him and only if you are in the least bit interested.

 

Russ

Image snip from the SR of Albert Hayes (courtesy FMP):

 

[mancpal]

RussT,

I have just read your last post. The OP in my opinion has approached this thread in the correct way, having related all the information they have found for themselves prior to making an enquiry. 
This thread is only 6hrs old and whilst you, I and others have made contributions so far perhaps the OP has a job, family or other concerns which prevent an instant response. 
Your “only if you’re in the least bit interested” comment is hardly likely to encourage new membership, we were all new to research and indeed this forum at some point. 
I find members who post a basic statement and then expect the forum to provide all the answers (possibly with ulterior motives) are of far more detriment to the cause of the friendly, generous research tool which is this forum.

Simon

[PRC]

6 hours ago, BevHerbert said:

My Great Grandfather was born in Charing, Kent in 1885. In 1911 he was living in Deal, Kent and (I think, writing isn't great) is described as a Reservist & Labourer. His marriage certificate in 1916 gives his address as 5 New Street, Deal and by 1921 he is working as a Window Cleaner back in Deal.

I agree that "Reservist + Labourer" is most likely what his occupation was given as on the 1911 Census of England & Wales when he was recorded living at No.5 New Street, Deal with parents Thomas & Ann and nine of his siblings. However this appears to be the only occasion pre-war his birth place is shown as Charing, Kent.

Parents Thomas and Ann state they have been married 26 years. A sample check of their siblings shows likely births recorded with the mothers' maiden name of Ansell, making it likely that the birth we are interested in was the George Rose, mothers' maiden name Ansell, which was registered with the civil authorities in the West Ashford District in the October to December quarter, (Q4), of 1885 - so no middle names at that point. The area covered by the West Ashford Civil Registration District included the civil parish of Charing amongst others. https://www.ukbmd.org.uk/reg/districts/west ashford.html

The baptism of a George Rose, no date of birth recorded, took place at Little Chart, Kent, on the 4th October 1885. The source "England Births and Christenings: 1538 -1975" I believe can be seen on genealogy sites like Ancestry or FindMyPast. It can also be seen on familysearch - free to join and use. https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:J7GN-3B5

On the 1891 Census of England & Wales when the family was recorded living at No.83a High Street, Deal, the 5 year old George Rose was shown as born Little Chart, Kent.
Little Chart fell within the West Ashford District for the Registration of Births, Marriages and Deaths.

The family appear to be totally elusive on the 1901 Censsus of England & Wales, and the 1911 Census has already been mentioned.

Deal fell within the Eastry civil registration district, so can I assume the 1916 marriage was the one that took place in that district in Q2 1916 between a George Rose and May L. Thomsett? Possible children May Winifred Rose, (Q4 1919) and George Thomas, (Q1 1921) - both mothers' maiden name Thomsett and registered in the Eastry District.

Reason for following the civil records is that one potential source for confirming his service details is the 1918 and 1919 Absent Voters Lists. These can contain service number and unit details.  A bit more on how this can help can be found on our parent site here https://www.longlongtrail.co.uk/soldiers/how-to-research-a-soldier/finding-soldiers-through-the-1918-absent-voters-lists/

The first hurdle will be finding out where someone might have considered their normal home address at that time.  The birth certificate for May could help with that - either because that was where she was born, (still the norm at that time), or as the address of the person who informed the registrar.
The second hurdle is then finding out whether the relevant AVL has survived and where it is held. The LLT says the Kent ones are available, but the website it then links to no longer exists. I've found where the site has migrated to but unfortunately doesn't look like it includes Eastry \ Deal.http://www.brickwallresearch.co.uk/our_publications.htm

Cheers,
Peter

[BevHerbert]

14 hours ago, mancpal said:

Bev,

I can’t really help with your questions. I would however like to congratulate you on providing the detail you have already which will no doubt save members their time rather than going over old ground (not all do and it can be frustrating to post on a thread only to find the OP already knows the information). Good luck with your quest.

Simon

Hi Simon, thank you so much for this lovely comment and for your input with the uniforms. It is hard to know how much to put in these messages!

I will be looking further into these brothers and their service in WWI. There were 6 brothers and one brother in law, I think, who were all "serving" in some capacity at the same time. I need to work out who is who in the wedding picture. They even had a 11 year old (?! this seems crazy!) in the R.M.L.I. Cadet Corps (David Stanley ROSE). The others are (according to a newspaper article in the Deal, Walmer & Sandwich Mercury, April 8th 1916) Sapper Stephen Edward ROSE (R.N.D.E.), Sapper Percival Charles ROSE (R.N.D.E.), Sapper Henry Thomas ROSE, R.N.D.E., Sapper Albert John "Jack" ROSE R.N.D.E. and their brother-in-law Pte James Samuel CURTIS, The Buffs. Their father Thomas ROSE was apparently in the National Reserve and had formerly been in the Royal West Kent Regiment. I had a brief search yesterday and could see that a couple were wounded but I think that all survived, so very fortunate. I found a great newspaper article detailing some of the content of letters sent home by Henry Thomas ROSE to his wife after he was shot in the shoulder and wounded for a short time. 

[BevHerbert]

13 hours ago, mancpal said:

Bev,

the other two could be Royal Engineers though this really is stretching it. Perhaps they were siblings of the groom or could it be the brides family on one side and the grooms on the other? 
I promise to leave you alone now as it’s my tea time !

Simon

Hi again Simon, thank you again for this info. Given the new information I found in the newspaper article, I suspect "The Buffs" was correct in your other message - I will try and find my photo list to see if this is indeed the Brother-in-Law in The Buffs. I suspect now that the others might be the R.N.D.E. folk? I will have a poke around online regarding the uniforms. The amount of information available somewhat snowballs once there is a lead to be had! Thanks again

[BevHerbert]

13 hours ago, ororkep said:

Your 27599 is actually a George William ROSE. if you are including a middle name then you have about seven others to consider as well with middle names beginning with A, H & W.

Obviously he can be excluded if your George had no middle name.

22196 was attached to RAMC

56503 served with 37 Siege Battery and was awarded a MM

168388 was probably with a AA Bty

129267 was with 78 Coy with British Medal only.

225252 was formally RFA Driver 31253 (was he good with horses?)

Rgds Paul

Hi Paul, thank you for all this new info - I will see what else I can narrow down with this. My George had no middle name. Nothing stands out at the moment (though I will have to google some of the terms here to be sure what they mean, sorry! Complete "L-plate" here) I don't know if he had any connection with horses (nothing I know about him would suggest so). Is it of any value to know if any of these different "roles" or Battery placements etc would have any connection to Deal, Kent? Or could a person be placed anywhere regardless of where they would have signed up? Steep learning curve for me, I think.

[BevHerbert]

13 hours ago, Michelle Young said:

The other two might be RMLI? 

Thanks Michelle, there is certainly some R.M.L.I. involvement in my family tree in general (possibly more common with Deal connections?) and I hadn't thought about the wider family that may be in the photo. There might be some in-laws here that I haven't considered yet. Somewhere I have a list of the potential names of the people in the photo but it isn't from a contemporary source, just recollections and possible guesses from years later. I will try and find this and post what I have.

[BevHerbert]

13 hours ago, RussT said:

He is 25 years old on the 1911 census.

There is a possibility he didn't serve overseas - so no MIC/Medal Roll

But let's assume he did, so out of the possible ones you list:

129267 is an RGA number allotted in November 1916.

168388 is a new army number allotted in May 1917

27599 is, as mentioned above, a man with the middle name William. He was discharged totally blind on 17/03/1916 - so also does not align with the marriage photo or marriage certificate dated 01/04/1916.

56503 is a short service duration of the war man enlisting in December 1914

225252 was an RGA number allotted in 1918

22196 would have been a regular soldier enlisting into the RGA in January 1905 for 3 years with the colours and 9 on the reserve. As noted above, he was attached to the RAMC (1st General Hospital according to his 1914 Star Medal Roll) and entering France on 18/08/1914. This man fits the known facts/observations:

 - He would have been around 19 to 20 years old on enlistment,

- He would be a reservist on the 1911 census as he would have completed his 3 years with the colours in 1908/1909,

- He would have been eligible for being mobilised as a reservist upon the outbreak of war in August 1914.

- He would have been a likely candidate to go out early to France in August 1914 as a re-called Reservist.

Therefore, my money is on him being 22196 George Rose RGA, attached RAMC - entitled to the Trio. Perhaps you can track down which member of the family might have this medals - and then check what details are impressed upon them.

Regards

Russ

 

Wow! Thank you for all this new information - do you mind if I ask how you found all this out? I feel bad if I could have looked all this up somewhere myself :O You have certainly completely narrowed it down and I can now focus on the one possible.

I have not heard about any medals in the possession of any extended family except for those of my other Great Grandfather (James Herbert, R.M.L.I.) I will certainly enquire explicitly now on the basis that this might be the right man. You never know what someone might have hidden in the attic! Thank you, again, for all this info.

[BevHerbert]

11 hours ago, RussT said:

You can look for Service Records for the other 20-odd RGA men who were also attached to the No 1 GH as per their 1914 Medal Roll.

Gunner 20866 Albert Hayes enlisted 13/09/1904 for a 3 + 9 Term of Engagement.

He was transferred to the 1st Class Army Reserve on 12/09/1907 upon completion of his Colour Service.

He was mobilised at the Plymouth RGA Depot and posted to the No 1 General Hospital on 05/08/1914.

His 1914 Medal Roll also states he disembarked for France on 18/08/1914 as does his Service Record - and as per that for Rose on his 1914 Medal Roll

He left the RAMC unit and joined 113th Heavy Battery on 20/01/1915 - his record provides all his later RGA-unit postings.

His VM/BWM Medal Roll does NOT state "Attached RAMC" (unlike that for George Rose) but just the very common "RGA Base Details".

I would conclude from this evidence therefore that George did indeed remain attached to an RAMC unit throughout his Service (possibly with the No 1 GH).

I would recommend going through the whole of the No 1 GH War Diary - it's free - you never know, he might be mentioned in it. But of course only if you think there is a possibility it's him and only if you are in the least bit interested.

 

Russ

Image snip from the SR of Albert Hayes (courtesy FMP):

 

Hi again Russ,

Thank you again for all of this new information and I am certainly very interested indeed, if not a little overwhelmed by it all and will need to take some time to go through everything properly and get my head around the terminology. It is like trying to learn a new language but I think I get a little better each time I try and learn something new!

[BevHerbert]

10 hours ago, mancpal said:

RussT,

I have just read your last post. The OP in my opinion has approached this thread in the correct way, having related all the information they have found for themselves prior to making an enquiry. 
This thread is only 6hrs old and whilst you, I and others have made contributions so far perhaps the OP has a job, family or other concerns which prevent an instant response. 
Your “only if you’re in the least bit interested” comment is hardly likely to encourage new membership, we were all new to research and indeed this forum at some point. 
I find members who post a basic statement and then expect the forum to provide all the answers (possibly with ulterior motives) are of far more detriment to the cause of the friendly, generous research tool which is this forum.

Simon

Hi Simon, thanks for sticking up for me  I actually didn't interpret the comment in the same way you have (so I am probably a bit naive!). I was online for quite a while after I first posted and kept checking back but, as you quite rightly point out, I then had to get back to "life" stuff and have come back this morning to an amazing tide of fabulous information. I have asked questions on this forum before and cannot tell you how much I appreciate the expertise that I have found here. I did try to do a bit of my own thinking and research before I started but, unfortunately, it did not amount to a great deal! I now have new avenues to explore and I am very grateful. It must sometimes be quite frustrating to those who spend their precious time helping Newbies like me, with no idea who that person is or what will be done with their knowledge and time, if anything. It always feels quite daunting (for me at least) to post here when I am so likely to sound like a fool and no doubt say something wrong along the way. It has always been worth finding the courage, so far

[BevHerbert]

10 hours ago, PRC said:

I agree that "Reservist + Labourer" is most likely what his occupation was given as on the 1911 Census of England & Wales when he was recorded living at No.5 New Street, Deal with parents Thomas & Ann and nine of his siblings. However this appears to be the only occasion pre-war his birth place is shown as Charing, Kent.

Parents Thomas and Ann state they have been married 26 years. A sample check of their siblings shows likely births recorded with the mothers' maiden name of Ansell, making it likely that the birth we are interested in was the George Rose, mothers' maiden name Ansell, which was registered with the civil authorities in the West Ashford District in the October to December quarter, (Q4), of 1885 - so no middle names at that point. The area covered by the West Ashford Civil Registration District included the civil parish of Charing amongst others. https://www.ukbmd.org.uk/reg/districts/west ashford.html

The baptism of a George Rose, no date of birth recorded, took place at Little Chart, Kent, on the 4th October 1885. The source "England Births and Christenings: 1538 -1975" I believe can be seen on genealogy sites like Ancestry or FindMyPast. It can also be seen on familysearch - free to join and use. https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:J7GN-3B5

On the 1891 Census of England & Wales when the family was recorded living at No.83a High Street, Deal, the 5 year old George Rose was shown as born Little Chart, Kent.
Little Chart fell within the West Ashford District for the Registration of Births, Marriages and Deaths.

The family appear to be totally elusive on the 1901 Censsus of England & Wales, and the 1911 Census has already been mentioned.

Deal fell within the Eastry civil registration district, so can I assume the 1916 marriage was the one that took place in that district in Q2 1916 between a George Rose and May L. Thomsett? Possible children May Winifred Rose, (Q4 1919) and George Thomas, (Q1 1921) - both mothers' maiden name Thomsett and registered in the Eastry District.

Reason for following the civil records is that one potential source for confirming his service details is the 1918 and 1919 Absent Voters Lists. These can contain service number and unit details.  A bit more on how this can help can be found on our parent site here https://www.longlongtrail.co.uk/soldiers/how-to-research-a-soldier/finding-soldiers-through-the-1918-absent-voters-lists/

The first hurdle will be finding out where someone might have considered their normal home address at that time.  The birth certificate for May could help with that - either because that was where she was born, (still the norm at that time), or as the address of the person who informed the registrar.
The second hurdle is then finding out whether the relevant AVL has survived and where it is held. The LLT says the Kent ones are available, but the website it then links to no longer exists. I've found where the site has migrated to but unfortunately doesn't look like it includes Eastry \ Deal.http://www.brickwallresearch.co.uk/our_publications.htm

Cheers,
Peter

Hi Peter,

Yes, this information is all correct. George ROSE was born 22 September 1885 in Charing - registered in Calehill, West Ashford 1885. Parents Thomas ROSE and Annie ANSELL. They were not in fact married until 1924, after having 12 children between 1885 and 1911 (this is the subject of a mystery in my tree - I believe Thomas was already married to someone else. There was a lot of "flexibility" in the truth of the answers given on their records over the years) The 1901 census for Deal has been lost so I assume they were living there somewhere but we will never confirm where from that record.

I will see what I can find out about the absent voters lists - I am a member of the Kent FHS so might see if they know something about it.

I don't have May's birth certificate but it is something that I SHOULD have so I will apply for that.

I appreciate all the input here - thank you.

[BevHerbert]

13 hours ago, RussT said:

He is 25 years old on the 1911 census.

There is a possibility he didn't serve overseas - so no MIC/Medal Roll

But let's assume he did, so out of the possible ones you list:

129267 is an RGA number allotted in November 1916.

168388 is a new army number allotted in May 1917

27599 is, as mentioned above, a man with the middle name William. He was discharged totally blind on 17/03/1916 - so also does not align with the marriage photo or marriage certificate dated 01/04/1916.

56503 is a short service duration of the war man enlisting in December 1914

225252 was an RGA number allotted in 1918

22196 would have been a regular soldier enlisting into the RGA in January 1905 for 3 years with the colours and 9 on the reserve. As noted above, he was attached to the RAMC (1st General Hospital according to his 1914 Star Medal Roll) and entering France on 18/08/1914. This man fits the known facts/observations:

 - He would have been around 19 to 20 years old on enlistment,

- He would be a reservist on the 1911 census as he would have completed his 3 years with the colours in 1908/1909,

- He would have been eligible for being mobilised as a reservist upon the outbreak of war in August 1914.

- He would have been a likely candidate to go out early to France in August 1914 as a re-called Reservist.

Therefore, my money is on him being 22196 George Rose RGA, attached RAMC - entitled to the Trio. Perhaps you can track down which member of the family might have this medals - and then check what details are impressed upon them.

Regards

Russ

 

Hi Russ, on the basis of what you have said here, that (if this is my George) he might have first enlisted much earlier (ie. age 19/20) - I thought of this photo that I have had for a long time now but without being sure of who it is. It says "For Mother with love from George". The person in it is so much younger than any of the other photographs that I have of George ROSE that I cannot discern any particular likeness (he does have the rather stern look!) but could this be him? I also have no expertise in terms of dating photographs or identifying uniforms so am of no use there either! Just thought I would post it just in case. Apologies if I am way off base here.

[Matlock1418]

18 hours ago, BevHerbert said:

Please would anyone be able to help with any pointers as to how I can uncover more information about my Great Grandfather George ROSE and his WWI Service?

Bev,

Welcome to GWF - you have clearly done a lot of research and given us much to work with. 

At the moment out of my field of knowledge I'm afraid

And you have received a lot to digest - so that will take time.

Meanwhicle you have offered us even more to consider.

Prividing lots of pieces of a jiigsaw can really help - or indicate you have two cases to expore 

20 minutes ago, BevHerbert said:

Think this is one for our uniform expert members, perhaps @FROGSMILE ?? - this mention should bring this photo to their notice.

To my non-expert eye it looks pre-war and a Canterbury photographer rather suits a Kent connection.

Wishing you the best of fortune.

M

[BevHerbert]

Just now, Matlock1418 said:

Bev,

Welcome to GWF - you have clearly done a lot of research and given us much to work with. 

At the moment out of my field of knowledge I'm afraid

And you have received a lot to digest - so that will take time.

Meanwhicle you have offered us even more to consider.

Prividing lots of pieces of a jiigsaw can really help - or indicate you have two cases to expore 

Think this is one for our uniform expert members, perhaps @FROGSMILE ?? - this mention should bring this photo to their notice.

To my non-expert eye it looks pre-war and a Canterbury photographer rather suits a Kent connection.

Wishing you the best of fortune.

M

Thank you for this lovely comment Matlock1418 - it is much appreciated. I do love a puzzle but it certainly helps a lot to be able to get help from people that know so much more than me!