Hon Patrick Julian Harry Stanley Ogilvy, MC, Irish Guards: Confused and Confusing Documentation.

[rolt968]

I may eventually ask the mods to attach this thread to the existing thread about Patrick JHS Ogilvy. However since I am asking about documentation I have started a new thread.

Normally when I read an officer's record at the National Archives, I expect it to clarify matters. I read all of Partick JHS Ogilvy's record and photographed most of it. Now I have started to research him properly and I have found some confusion in the documents about his service before joining the Irish Guards (and indeed when he joined the Irish Guards).

• He enlisted in the Fife and Forfar Yeomanry in Forfar on 3 August 1914 and was allocated the serial number 1907 (Attestation Form). (First point of confusion - a number of secondary sources say he served in Scottish Horse!)
• Embodied 5 August 1914.
• 24 August 1914: Discharged to a commission [in F&FY] (This on a page where dates have been altered and it was signed off in 1917.)
• 26 August 1914: Commissioned 2/Lt in Fife and ForfaR Yeomanry. (I haven't been able to find this in the London Gazette, but it may be there as the OCR doesn't seem to like "Patrick Ogilvy" or the full form of his name.) I got the date from the November 1914 Army List.
• 3 October 1914: Signed application for Special Reserve Commission in Irish Guards. Gave his occupation as 2/Lt, Fife and Forfar Yeomanry. Rather oddly against Questions 12 d and e (about the end of previous service) he originally wrote "Still serving" [in F&FY] but this has been scored out and changed to 2nd October - for personal reasons.
• 6 October 1914: Commissoned (apparently) 2/Lt, Special Reserve, Irish Guards. London Gazette, 23 October 1914.
• Both the November 1914 and the January 1915 Army Lists show him as 2/Lt., Fife and Forfar Yeomanry, Commissioned 26 August 1914 (Name: Ogilvy, P.) and as 2/Lt (on probation) Irish Guards [no battalion], Commissioned 6 October 1914 (Name: Ogilvy, Hon. PJHS.)
• His name had disappeared from the F&FY by the June 1915 Army List.
• His record of service pages for service in the ranks of F&FY had originally contained an entry calculated until June 1915. This has been scored out and entries rewritten (except one) to show service in the ranks finishing on 24 August 1914. However this page was signed in 1917.
• 18 June 1915 Commissioned 2/Lt, Special Reserve, Irish Guards. Back dated to 6 October 1914.  London Gazette, 18 June 1915.
• 20 January 1916: Arrived in theatre of war. Even this has been altered; the 20 is written over another number and 1915 has been altered to 1916 on the Medal Rolls Index Card. His mother applied for and was not granted, a 1914-15 Star.
• He arrived at 1 Irish Guards at Wormhoudt on 8 March 1916 from 10 Entrenching Battalion.

I think after that his service is clear, except that apparently someone thought he was still serving in the ranks of the Fife and Forfar Yeomanry and allocated him a new number in the 1917 renumbering (See attached document).

 

At the end of all that lot, I feel a bit confused.

I would welcome comments.

Particularly in which unit (if any) was he serving between October 1914 and about May 1915?

RM

 

 

 

Edited 18 July by rolt968