The banning of long bladed weapons

[Dust Jacket Collector]

I’ve just read on the BBC website about the up coming ban on so-called ‘Zombie’ knives. There’s no mention of any exclusions for historic weapons and I’m wondering if any members are aware of any such as I imagine many WW1 bayonets would fall into the definitions listed below. I even have a few Mediaeval pole arms which are certainly long, sharp and with lots of pointy bits!

This is from the Beeb website:-

“Zombie knives were first banned in 2016 but a new, broader definition, externaldesigned to outlaw more blades will take effect in England and Wales on 24 September.

From then it will be illegal to own a knife with a sharpened blade longer than 8in (20cm), if it also has other features, including:

• A serrated cutting edge

• More than one hole in the blade

• Spikes

• More than two sharp points in the blade”

[RedCoat]

When the primary issue is too radioactive, go hard on the secondary!

Edited 12 September by RedCoat

[Michael Haselgrove]

Hi Dust Jacket Collector,

Try a search asking a question like "are there any exemptions to the zombie knife ban".  That may help answering your question.

Best wishes,

Michael. 

[Dave66]

I can’t post a link, but there is a visual representation of the type of things being banned via the .gov website. From what I can see plain bayonets should be ok, where you may get a problem is where you have examples of saw back bayonets….i suppose it all boils down to how individuals interpret the laws and if the law is ever tested.

Dave.

Edit….screenshot below from .gov, historic things should be safe.

Edited 12 September by Dave66

[Dust Jacket Collector]

Thanks Dave. I think it looks as if period weapons are exempt. Phew!

[keithmroberts]

There must be a formal official  document that is precise. I suspect that this is secondary legislation, and someone digging into gov.uk should be able to find the legal wording. 

Edited 13 September by keithmroberts

[TEW]

I had a look yesterday and found legislation regarding Curved Bladed Weapons and Ninja Blades which appear to be different to Zombie knives.

The nomenclature for various items seems complicated and determining what type of blade fits each category equally so.

Items over 100 years old seem to be exempt but that may depend on length and/or any curvature.

There's a list of Defences against Section 141 Criminal Justice Act 1988;

It is a defence for a person charged with an offence under subsection (1A) to show that the weapon in question is one of historical importance.

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1988/33/section/141

TEW

 

[depaor01]

44 minutes ago, TEW said:

...but that may depend on length and/or any curvature.

In that case Chassepot bayonet ownership could potentially be illegal in UK.

[CorporalPunishment]

The problem is that when the knife-wielding scum find out that it's ok to own a ww1 bayonet then it will be back to square one. Vermin extermination is not easy.         Pete.

[Ian Riley]

We have come some way from 1959 and a 12 year-old me entering an antique shop in Anglesey unaccompanied, proffering 12s 6d (it might have been ten bob) and walking out onto the street with an unwrapped chassepot bayonet that is on the hearth downstairs today. I then walked into the rather swish hotel where my grandparents were staying, waved it over my head in the lounge and plonked it on the table set for afternoon tea. I am hoping that I will be able to claim that it is of historical importance. 

Edited Monday at 22:14 by Ian Riley

[Alan24]

On 12/09/2024 at 10:16, Dust Jacket Collector said:

 serrated cutting edge

• More than one hole in the blade

• Spikes

• More than two sharp points in the blade”

I too read this story the other day and it came back to me as I was washing up a cheese knife last night. 

Blade about 6" long with about five half inch dia. holes in the blade and two points on the end for picking up the cheese. 

[Dust Jacket Collector]

2 hours ago, Alan24 said:

I too read this story the other day and it came back to me as I was washing up a cheese knife last night. 

Blade about 6" long with about five half inch dia. holes in the blade and two points on the end for picking up the cheese. 

Expect a visit from the Old Bill any moment now!

I once bought a 16thC pole arm from an auction in Lewes, 8ft long with an 18 inch blade and several sharp points, and then carry it through town past the local police station. Not sure I’d try that now!

[Chasemuseum]

9 hours ago, Alan24 said:

two points on the end for picking up the cheese

Multiple crimes there. Cheese comes from dairy, - cows burp and release methane - serious atmospheric carbon release for global warming. Additionally, cheese is a high fat food product, which will be illegal on the public health/vegan manifesto. So having a cheese knife is the criminal charges for conspiracy to possess cheese, conspiracy to supply and conspiracy with intent to consume.

[Alan24]

12 hours ago, Chasemuseum said:

Multiple crimes there. Cheese comes from dairy, - cows burp and release methane - serious atmospheric carbon release for global warming. Additionally, cheese is a high fat food product, which will be illegal on the public health/vegan manifesto. So having a cheese knife is the criminal charges for conspiracy to possess cheese, conspiracy to supply and conspiracy with intent to consume.

Guilty, M'Lud

[depaor01]

1 hour ago, Alan24 said:

Guilty, M'Lud

Clap 'em on guv. Banged to rights and no mistake.

[TEW]

From the CPS website:

Quote

An article which is bladed or sharply pointed.
The article does not have to be sharp: a butter knife, with no cutting edge and no point, is a bladed article. 

There are different laws in play here, each (I think)  with amendments

Prevention of Crime Act 1953.
Criminal Justice Act 1988. Changes to this Act are due 24/9/24 to include Zombie Knives.
Offensive Weapons Act 2019

A Zombie Knife is:

The weapon sometimes known as a ‘zombie-style’ knife or ‘zombie-style’ machete, being a bladed article with—

(i) a plain cutting edge;

(ii) a sharp pointed end; and  Not the cheese knife?

(iii) a blade of over eight inches in length (the length of the blade being the straight-line distance from the top of the handle to the tip of the blade),

which also has one or more of the following features, the specified features are:

— (a) a serrated cutting edge (other than a serrated cutting edge of up to two inches next to the handle);

(b) more than one hole in the blade;

(c) spikes;

(d) more than two sharp points in the blade other than: Your cheese knife only has two points!!

(a) a sharp point where the angle between the edges which create the point is an angle of at least 90 degrees (where there is a curved edge, the angle will be measured by reference to the tangent of the curve); This sort of thing is why barristers earn lots of money

(b) a sharp point on the cutting edge of the blade near the handle.

Regarding items such as sawbacks:

It shall be a defence...........in respect of any conduct of his relating to a weapon to which section 141 of the Criminal Justice Act 1988 applies by virtue of paragraph 1(r) to show that the weapon in question was made before 1954 or was made at any other time according to traditional methods of making swords by hand.

TEW

[trajan]

17 hours ago, Chasemuseum said:

Multiple crimes there. Cheese comes from dairy, - cows burp and release methane - serious atmospheric carbon release for global warming. Additionally, cheese is a high fat food product, which will be illegal on the public health/vegan manifesto. So having a cheese knife is the criminal charges for conspiracy to possess cheese, conspiracy to supply and conspiracy with intent to consume.

[RaySearching]

22 hours ago, Chasemuseum said:

Multiple crimes there. Cheese comes from dairy, - cows burp and release methane - serious atmospheric carbon release for global warming. Additionally, cheese is a high fat food product, which will be illegal on the public health/vegan manifesto. So having a cheese knife is the criminal charges for conspiracy to possess cheese, conspiracy to supply and conspiracy with intent to consume.

Un-brie-lievable

Tread Caerphilly otherwise the mods will lock this thread

[depaor01]

I did forget I was in the main forum previously so apologies.