Miss E.L. Rendle, V.A.D., lived or died ?

[Jim Strawbridge]

The Army Register of Soldiers' Effects has brought to me a puzzle. Miss E.L. Rendle, VAD, is shown as having died at the 4th Southern General Hospital, Plymouth on the 26th August 1918. Using BMD no death for her is registered. There is a Elsie Louise Rendle (born 1892) who died on that date in Matlock, Derbyshire and is buried there. I do not believe that this is the casualty. The BRCS record cards (there are two of them) show that an Elsie Louise Rendle was employed as a nurse - one shows at Exeter and the other at a military hospital in Plymouth. In both cases she is shown with an address at 12 Diamond Avenue, Plymouth. At other Plymouth addresses she can be found in the 1901 and 1911 censuses. An Elsie Rendle had her birth registered in Plymouth in the third quarter 1892 and this fits in with her age of 23 when she was engaged by the BRCS in 1915. The Army Register plainly shows "died" yet no registration can be found. The 1939 Census Register shows an incapacitated Elsie Rendle (born 7th July 1892) living at 47 King Gardens, Plymouth. An Elsie Randle died in the third quarter 1963 in Plymouth aged 71 who I believe was her. We have only known the Register to show disposals of funds through death or insanity but I wonder, due to the "incapacity" noted in the 1939 Register, whether she was unable to manage her own affairs in 1918 and that the note of "died" is an error. This is the only conclusion that I can draw unless someone has other thoughts.

[Jrmh]

FMP shows Elsie Lili Rendle born in 1897 in Plymouth living there in 1921 Census. May be worth a look?

[Jim Strawbridge]

7 hours ago, Jrmh said:

FMP shows Elsie Lili Rendle born in 1897 in Plymouth living there in 1921 Census. May be worth a look?

Thank you.

[TEW]

There does seem to be an Elsie Louise Rendle born Poplar 1st Qtr. 1892 as well as an Elsie Rendle born Plymouth 3rd Qtr 1892. The latter must be the one you have on 1939 census.

An Elsie L Rendle marrys in Plymouth 1922 to Mr Herbert Tookey. She appears to be Elsie Lillian born 1895 and died Plymouth 1963.

So you have two Elsie Rendles in the Plymouth area simultaneously which won't help!!

I had a record of a soldier who died in Newton Abbot hospital while Soldiers' Effects said Exeter and death was registered at his home location.  Your VAD seems more complicated.

TEW

[Jim Strawbridge]

I had found your Poplar lady but discounted her as she seemed to have no connection to Devon. The same with the Matlock woman.

[charlie962]

This beneficiary in the Soldier's Effects is unusual and may provide a clue:

Courtesy Ancestry 

 

[TEW]

I see the SE entry gives her Administratrix in May 1921 as Mrs Alice Britton.

Not sure we're seeing the same entry Charlie?

TEW

Sorry, my error. Scrub Mrs Britton.

TEW

[charlie962]

NA have this as possible connection of a Cowan to Roumania?

https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/results/r?_q=+Cowan+roumania

[alf mcm]

Jim,

  The Matlock woman does have a connection with Devon.

Elsie Louise Rendle was baptised in Bromley, Tower Hamlets on 3rd February 1892. Her parents were William Arthur Rendle, mariner, and Mary Anne Rendle. They were married in 1890.

William Arthur Rendle died in Hong Kong in 1901. His gravestone has the inscription 'Also of their dearly loved daughter Elsie Louise  ,,,. died Matlock .. 1918.

https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/97612537/elsie-louise-rendle

Elsie's mother re-marriod to William Ramsay in Plymouth in 1903.

William appears to have died and Elsie and her mother are living in Plymouth in 1911.

The reference to the hospital in in Plymouth seems to refer to where Elsie was working, rather than where she died.

Elsie's mother's maiden name was Cowan, also referred to in the Register of Soldiers Effects.

Regards,

Alf McM

Edited Sunday at 09:39 by alf mcm
link to gravestone added

[charlie962]

17 hours ago, Jim Strawbridge said:

having died at the 4th Southern General Hospital, Plymouth o

She didn't die there. That was her 'unit'

Again courtesy Ancestry 

[Jrmh]

Worth £3 to find out?

https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/

[alf mcm]

2 hours ago, charlie962 said:

She didn't die there. That was her 'unit'

Again courtesy Ancestry 

Charlie,

 Her 'unit' was actually Devon Voluntary Aid Detachment number 4 {Devon/4}.

Regards,

Alf McM

[PaulC78]

8 hours ago, alf mcm said:

Elsie Louise Rendle was baptised in Bromley, Tower Hamlets on 3rd February 1892. Her parents were William Arthur Rendle, mariner, and Mary Anne Rendle. They were married in 1890.

William Arthur Rendle died in Hong Kong in 1901. His gravestone has the inscription 'Also of their dearly loved daughter Elsie Louise  ,,,. died Matlock .. 1918.

https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/97612537/elsie-louise-rendle

Elsie's mother re-marriod to William Ramsay in Plymouth in 1903.

William appears to have died and Elsie and her mother are living in Plymouth in 1911.

I assume we've also seen the headstone for Elise at Matlock:

https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/192071615/elsie-louise-rendle

This states that she was the daughter of "the late William Rendle and Mary Ramsay (formerly Rendle)", which ties in with the 1911 Census record at Plymouth for Mary Ann Ramsay and Elsie Louise Rendle.

I'm inclined to think that she is the same Elsie recorded in SER.

[PaulC78]

Overseas death record for W A Rendle shows that he was First Mate on the Kaifong and died from paralysis. Address given is 4 Knutsford Terrace, Kowloon, but he was born in Plymouth.

On 12/10/2024 at 17:16, Jim Strawbridge said:

she is shown with an address at 12 Diamond Avenue

1921 Census for Mary A Ramsay places her at the same address:

(Source: FindMyPast)

She died at Plymouth in 1927:

(Source: Ancestry)

Edited Sunday at 19:30 by PaulC78

[Jrmh]

Parents’ Marriage courtesy of FreeBMD and birth courtesy of GRO:

 

 

Edited Monday at 09:16 by Jrmh

[Jim Strawbridge]

Thank you, everyone, for your contributions. I am of the opinion that the Elsie Louise Rendle that I have been trying to establish as being the Plymouth VAD is the woman who died in Matlock, Derbyshire. Why she was in Derbyshire I do not know. Perhaps on holiday or there were relatives there. I made the rooky mistake in seeing in the Army Register of Soldiers' Effects the Southern General Hospital, Plymouth as her place of death. As charley962 has said, looking at the heading this shows her place of service. But I am convinced that some registers has this same column with place of death. We live and learn. My eventual mini biography now looks like this. 

Rendle

Elsie Louise

Rank/Title/Service Number:                                                                                        

Unit/Force: Voluntary Aid Detachment           

Place/Date of Birth: London; Bromley-by-Bow/1892         

Place/Date of Death: Derbyshire; Matlock/26/8/18

Age: 26 or 27

Place of Burial/Memorial: United Kingdom; Derbyshire; Matlock; St. Giles churchyard  

Remarks: Mary Ann Cowan married William Arthur Rendle in the 1st quarter 1890 in the Poplar registration district. The 1891 census finds Mary Rendle (b. 1865 in Poplar) living on her own at 88 Turners Road, Poplar, London. She was probably pregnant with Elsie and her husband at sea. William Rendle (b. Plymouth on the 11th March 1863, d. 6th May 1901 in Hong Kong) obtained his second mates certificate on the 22nd Sepetember 1882, his first mates certificate on the 26th March 1886 and his masters certificate on the 16th August 1888. The birth of Elsie Louise Rendle was registered in the 1st quarter 1892 in the Poplar registration district. Elsie Louise Rendle was baptised in St. Michael and All Angels church, Bromley by Bow, London on the 3rd February 1892. Her parents are shown as William Arthur Rendle (a mariner) and Mary Anne Rendle. They were living at 1 Wyvis Street, Poplar, London. We have been unable to find the family in the 1901 census and suspect that Mary and Elsie were on a ship with William or called to Hong Kong because of his illness there. He was, apparently, the first mate on the SS Kaifong and died from paralysis. Mary Ann Rendle married William Ramsey (stet) in the 2nd quarter 1903 in the Plymouth registration district. He seems to have died around 1907 although registration of his death has yet to be found. Perhaps, like her first husband, he was a seaman and died overseas. The 1911 census finds the family living at 47 Hill Park Crescent, Plymouth, Devon. Mary Ann Ramsay is a widow living on her own means. She had been married for four years. With her is her daughter, Elsie Louise Randle (b. 1892 in Bromley, London (not Bromley, Kent), no occupation shown). There are two BRCS record service cards for this woman. The first shows that Elsie Louise Rendle of 12 Diamond Avenue, Plymouth, Devon was engaged as a nurse by VAD/Devon 4 on the 21st May 1915 at the rate of 10/- per week the contract terminating on the 4th June 1916. This shows that she served at Exeter 5 Hospital, Devon. The second record card shows Elsie Louise Rendle of 12 Diamond Avenue, Plymouth employed for the same period but at the Military Hospital, Plymouth. Some of these record cards were completed months and even years after the service shown and we believe that she served at both locations latterly in Plymouth as the Army Register shows her at Southern General Hospital, Plymouth. The Army Register of Soldiers' Effects shows that £10 was dispersed to James Cowan by authority of His Britannic Majesty's Vice Consul, Braila, Roumania. James Cowan was possibly an uncle as her mother's maiden name was Cowan. The death of Ethel L. Rendle was registered in the 3rd quarter 1918 in Bakewell, Derbyshire. She is shown as aged 27. Her connection to Derbyshire is unknown. The 1921 census shows Mrs Mary Ramsay the head and only occupant at 12 Diamond Avenue, Plymouth. The Probate Register shows Mary Ann Ramsay died on the 29th September 1927 at 12 Diamond Avenue, Plymouth. Elsie is remembered on her father's grave marker in Hong Kong Cemetery, Happy Valley, Hong Kong that reads :- "In ever loving memory of William Arthur Rendle beloved husband of Mary Rendle who died 6th May 1901. Aged 37 years. Forever with the Lord. Also of their dearly loved daughter Elsie Louise who died at Matlock, Derbyshire August 26th 1918. Aged 28. Simply to thy cross I cling". Elsie's grave marker reads :- "In Affectionate Memory of Elsie Louise Rendle. Beloved daughter of the late William Rendle and Mary Ramsay (stet) (formerly Rendle) who died at Matlock Aug.26.1918. Aged 26 years. Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord. Rev. XIV.13".