Jerrymurland Posted 4 November , 2006 Share Posted 4 November , 2006 I was recently asked for an essential reading list that gave an overall picture of the Great War, While I know little if anything about the naval actions I proposed the following list: Gallipoli - Moorhead Gallipoli - Carlyon The Kaisers Battle - Middlebrook the First day on the Somme - Middlebrook They Called it Passchendaele - McDonald 1915 - ditto To the Last Man - ditto Somme - ditto Vimy - Berton The Road to Verdun - Ousby Attrition - Neillands Haig's command - winter A Short History of the RFC in WW1 - Barker The airman's War - Liddle The Evolution of Victory - Simpson These are all books that I have read but there must be many more that would or should be considered essential reading - so please add to the list. Jerry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianw Posted 4 November , 2006 Share Posted 4 November , 2006 There is such a vast bibliography of the Great War that attempting an essential reading list is really a bit presumptious - a bit like "my best 10 rock albums ever". I would like to see more written by those that were actually there - especially those that can actually write a bit - although the less proficient should not be ignored. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Broomfield Posted 4 November , 2006 Share Posted 4 November , 2006 I'd agree with Ian, but two books I would have (and which sort of fall into his categorisation) are "The Middle Parts of Fortune" by Frederic Manning; and "Some Desperate Glory" by Edward Campion Vaughan. Oh, and "English Journey" by J B Preistley: not Great War, but a good idea of what post-War England looked and felt like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Bennitt Posted 4 November , 2006 Share Posted 4 November , 2006 Some of those, like Winter on Haig, will no doubt stir some members of this forum into commenting, and there are more recent works on Gallipoli that are more reliable than Moorehead. There should be one or more general histories in there (Strachan, Cruttwell?). For the navy, I would suggest 'Castles of Steel' by Massie, or if you want to be really thorough, Marder's 'From the Dreadnought to Scapa Flow' (5 vols). This is just off the top of my head (though I would agree with Steven for Manning and Vaughan). For an RFC memoir, 'Sagittarius Rising' by Cecil Lewis. But as Steven says, the list could be endless. Seem to remember a Desert Island books thread on here not so long ago. cheers Martin B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinWills Posted 4 November , 2006 Share Posted 4 November , 2006 Rather than add a specific list I thought I might add some general comments. I am also assuming we are assembling a shortlist we could use to reflect the war as a whole. For these reasons I would not focus on a list of "favourites" but a set of volumes that would give the reader a good overall perspective of the war. I think the list is over "heavy" with Macdonald, an author I find not to be as "complete" as I would like, but against the background of removing some Macdonald I would add "Roses of no Man's Land" for its medical insight. I'd probably replace Moorhead with Hart & Steel's "Defeat at Gallipoli" though there are other options. Some single volume personal memoirs would be a good addition to paint the picture of the individual experience, Cecil Lewis, as already mentioned paints a good picture of a young man going to war in the RFC.There are many that could be mentioned and others will have their favourites, so picked at random one might suggest "There's a Devil in the Drum" (Lucy) there are others but something of that ilk should be in a core collection. Something should be there on the French & German experiences (Verdun apart - that is already covered) as well as the 1914 war of movement. Perhaps Paul Lintier's "My 75" would cover the experience of the French in 1914 and Walter Bloem's "Advance from Mons" the early German experience. That does limit it to 1914 for the French & Germans, however. Cambrai is a notable omission for the turning point it almost was and the home front should receive some attention for it's social impact. The last 100 days should be covered to represent the brilliant successes of that period as well, perhaps, as reflecting that the Yanks had arrived. Turning to the war as a world war I think a general history such as Cruttwell (or Strachan, perhaps) is essential. Althought the list is almost all Western Front we should also include some coverage of the "sideshows". Gallipoli is there but what about Salonika (the recent Moody & Wakefield Under the Devil's Eye, perhaps) and Egypt & Palestine together with Mesopotamia should not be ignored either. The Italian front also sdeserves an outing - perhaps with Gladden's memoir "Across the Piave" which is a brilliant read. The Naval side will spark much debate, but if I had to add a single volume here it would be to cover Jutland. Again Hart & Steel offer a volume which also puts it in perspective or to go with an excellent and fairly comprehensive set of personal accounts following through the action there is Fawcett & Hooper "The Fighting at Jutland" which is one of the most effective accounts I have read, made more immediate for the contributions having been gathered in the 5 years following the action. I would be careful in selecting personal memoirs throughout because in such a list they would need to reflect the individual experience as well as the context of the events. Finally I wonder if we should add something covering the causes and the aftermath of the Armistice and peace treaty to set the whole in context. AND what about something outlining the "revisionist" approach - not necessarily to be agreed with, but to ensure the current debates are understood. Whilst I haven't always identified volumes I hope this gives food for thought and further debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_Baker Posted 4 November , 2006 Share Posted 4 November , 2006 Great WW1 bibliography: http://www.firstworldwar.bham.ac.uk/bibliography/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinWills Posted 4 November , 2006 Share Posted 4 November , 2006 Chris, It's a fine resource (and I'm not criticising it - I often use it), but I think what we started trying to do is develop a small library or reading list for someone wanting to understand the war and it's history from a list of (say) no more than 30 books. I don't suppose we will get there but it's interesting to speculate! Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Take on me Posted 4 November , 2006 Share Posted 4 November , 2006 The First World War-John Terraine. 1914-1918-David Stevenson. Paths of Glory-Anthony Clayton. The Price of Glory-Alistair Horne. IWM book of the Somme- Malcolm Brown. IWM book of 1918- Malcolm Brown. Passchendaele, The Untold Story- Robin Prior and Trevor Wilson. To Win A War- John Terraine. All Quiet on the Western Front- Remarque. Tommy-Richard Holmes. A People's Tragedy, The Russian Revolution-Orlando Figes. Forgotten Victory-Gary Sheffield. Jon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenwoodman Posted 4 November , 2006 Share Posted 4 November , 2006 Martin I believe has made a good contribution, and in the same spirit I would question the inclusion of Winter, which is unreliable. By all means something from the "Butcher/Bungler" wing of the debate, but balanced with something more revisionist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
armourersergeant Posted 5 November , 2006 Share Posted 5 November , 2006 This is a difficult list to comply, being that different people different writing styles come into play, however there does seem to be a core list coming together. I would second Wakefeild and Moody's book on Salonika, and when they get there pencil scribbling faster there should be another for Mespot/palestine way if memory serves correctly. Also 'Memories of Four fronts' by Sir William Marshall is a balanced view, IMO, by a commander who served in command out in Mespot. The biggest trouble here though is as most of us has found that to study in any depth, to give clarity , is too have no floor space, with the volumes required! Oh and to counter Winter's book, I would include 'The educated soldier' by J Terraine, \which swings perhaps to the other side of the pendulum to give an overall view of Haig. also something from the more recent command and control school of thought and I would say 'Firepower' by Bidwell and Graham, Paddy Griffiths book of the same elk and Prior and Wilson's book on Rawlinson. I can see this poor chaps floor disappearing as we type! regards Arm. Oh and an essentail for a starter or expereinced reader, an all in one volume of how the army got to and maintained itself in the feild, Charles Messengers volume 'Call to Arms' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinWills Posted 5 November , 2006 Share Posted 5 November , 2006 Perhaps in a week or so we could gather all the suggestions and compile a list based on (say) 20 (perhaps 25) volumes, in each case with a very brief positioning summary. Lets see! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerrymurland Posted 5 November , 2006 Author Share Posted 5 November , 2006 but I think what we started trying to do is develop a small library or reading list for someone wanting to understand the war and it's history from a list of (say) no more than 30 books. This I think sums up what the thread is trying to achieve, my origional list seems to have provided the catalyst for debate - a very interesting one as well! Yes in a week or so a core list could be drawn from these interesting posts. Jerry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
armourersergeant Posted 5 November , 2006 Share Posted 5 November , 2006 To do that you may wish to consider a category list say for instance. 1...Western front 2...Other theatres (notice i did not say side shows) 3...Memoirs, those that were there 4...Command and Control 5...Sea and Air 6...Misc regards Arm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerrymurland Posted 6 November , 2006 Author Share Posted 6 November , 2006 Good idea Arm - I'll have a go at an Aunt Sally for people to take apart! I notice on your WFA weblink you have a Northamptonshire Yeomanry connection. a relative of mine Gerald Murland won an MC with the Yeomanry at Monchy in 1917- I have his papers and medals. i have been researching his army service recently and stumbled across a mine of information at the Northamptonshire Records Office. Jerry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Saunders Posted 6 November , 2006 Share Posted 6 November , 2006 Oh and to counter Winter's book, I would include 'The educated soldier' by J Terraine, \which swings perhaps to the other side of the pendulum to give an overall view of Haig. I was discussing the new Haig biography (Reid) with a university lecturer last weekend and he suggested that the de Groot biography is probably the best. Personally speaking I would not recommend Haig: A Reassessment or The Educated Soldier (or Reid from what I have seen so far) so Im happy to try de Groot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenwoodman Posted 6 November , 2006 Share Posted 6 November , 2006 I was thinking of suggesting de Groot, Jonathan, but its difficult to come by. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevem49 Posted 6 November , 2006 Share Posted 6 November , 2006 I was recently asked for an essential reading list that gave an overall picture of the Great War, While I know little if anything about the naval actions I proposed the following list: Gallipoli - Moorhead Gallipoli - Carlyon The Kaisers Battle - Middlebrook the First day on the Somme - Middlebrook They Called it Passchendaele - McDonald 1915 - ditto To the Last Man - ditto Somme - ditto Vimy - Berton The Road to Verdun - Ousby Attrition - Neillands Haig's command - winter A Short History of the RFC in WW1 - Barker The airman's War - Liddle The Evolution of Victory - Simpson These are all books that I have read but there must be many more that would or should be considered essential reading - so please add to the list. Jerry Whilst I like most people have read many titles, I find the most interesting ones are my 'written by one who was there titles' and post war books. The Retreat from Mons by Major A Corbett-Smith 1917. With French in France and Flanders by Owen Spencer Watkins - Chaplain to the Forces. 1915 At the war by Lord Northcliffe 1916 Some War Diaries, Addresses, and Correspondences of The Earl of Ypres (Haig) - 1937 The Great World War - A History (nine volumes) 1920 editor - Frank A Mumby. They all give a fascinating insight into the views at the time. Also at a time when books are being brought out with the 'last Tommies', Fifty Amazing Stories of the Great War, 1936 which includes such things as 'Christmas in the Trenches by Bruce Bairnsfather. I just love em. stevem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PBI Posted 6 November , 2006 Share Posted 6 November , 2006 For an Unglamourised Account of The Life And Death of The PBI in the Great War,may i suggest 3 Books which i regard as 3 of the best writings by Private Soldiers to come out of the Great War. 1) Of Those We Loved. by I.L.Read. 2) The Bells Of Hell Go Ting A Ling A Ling.By Eric Hiscock. 3) Men of 18 in 1918.By F.J.Hodges. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armoured Farmer Posted 6 November , 2006 Share Posted 6 November , 2006 The War The Infantry Knew 1914-1918, by JC DUNN. An account of the war through the eyes of a battalion medical officer. Well worth the time taken to read it. So good the beggar who borrowed it hasn't brought it back after 15 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
armourersergeant Posted 6 November , 2006 Share Posted 6 November , 2006 I was discussing the new Haig biography (Reid) with a university lecturer last weekend and he suggested that the de Groot biography is probably the best. Personally speaking I would not recommend Haig: A Reassessment or The Educated Soldier (or Reid from what I have seen so far) so Im happy to try de Groot. My Birmingham sources seem to imply also that Reid is not so good. I choose Terraines book just so for the reason that it was the other end of the spectrum. Given that this is a short list perhaps only one book on Haig is enough, I too have heard De Groot is good and fair. Arm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
armourersergeant Posted 6 November , 2006 Share Posted 6 November , 2006 Good idea Arm - I'll have a go at an Aunt Sally for people to take apart! I notice on your WFA weblink you have a Northamptonshire Yeomanry connection. a relative of mine Gerald Murland won an MC with the Yeomanry at Monchy in 1917- I have his papers and medals. i have been researching his army service recently and stumbled across a mine of information at the Northamptonshire Records Office. Jerry Recently had an oppotunity to skim through some diaries from Yeomanry people when we had a Somme open evening in July, keep promising to get back there to have a look but not had time as yet. Glad you had some success though Arm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerrymurland Posted 6 November , 2006 Author Share Posted 6 November , 2006 Recently had an oppotunity to skim through some diaries from Yeomanry people I can mail you some of the diaries I copied of the Monchy excursion of April 11th 1917 and extracts from others. Let me know. Jerry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PBI Posted 6 November , 2006 Share Posted 6 November , 2006 I still rate Mr.Middlebrook as must read Author on subjects of WW1 interest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mruk Posted 6 November , 2006 Share Posted 6 November , 2006 There is one genre which I can't abide at all, and that is the semibiographical account, and that of the type offered by top-ranking officers and politicians, and though I don't mind the diary-type, most works don't offer anything other than strategy and stats, and most leave me cold. I feel there is a lack of empathy with the ordinary soldier, and aside from the odd insight into a particular action, most are an expression of self-congratulatory praise. A friend of mine suggested that they should be compulsory reading in universities, but I would have to say that it's difficult keeping students awake at the best of times. I know-'I Was There'. Cheers, Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mruk Posted 6 November , 2006 Share Posted 6 November , 2006 Sorry, I forgot to add my list Joanna Bourke 'Dismembering the Male: Men's Bodies, Britain and the Great War' Modris Eksteins 'Rites of Spring: The Great War and the Birth of the Modern Age' George Mosse 'Fallen Soldiers: Reshaping the Memory of the World Wars' Jay Winter 'Sites of Memory, Sites of Mourning' Geoff Dyer 'The Missing of the Somme' [This one nearly had me in tears last week on the bus to Bradford] Kind Regards, Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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